Japanese American Evacuation
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Use Restrictions
This is a slightly edited transcription of an interview conducted for the Oral History Program, sponsored by California State University, Fullerton. The reader should be aware that an oral history document portrays information as recalled by the interviewee. Because of the spontaneous nature of this kind of document, it may contain statements and impressions which are not factual
Scholars are welcome to utilize short excerpts from any of the transcriptions without obtaining permission as long as proper credit is given to the interviewee, the interviewer, and the University. Scholars must, however, obtain permission from California State University, Fullerton before making more extensive use of the transcription and related materials. None of these materials may be duplicated or reproduced by any party without permission from the Oral History Program, California State University, Fullerton, Fullerton, California, 92834-6846.
Interview
- Interviewee:
- Masako Tashima
- Interviewer:
- Pat Tashima
- Subject:
- Japanese American Evacuation
- Date:
- June 1 1974
This is an interview with Mrs. Masako Yagi Tashima, one of the oldest Nisei in California today, by Pat Tashima, her granddaughter, for the California State University, Fullerton, Japanese American Oral History Project, on June 1, 1974. Mary Tashima, the daughter-in-law of the interviewee and the mother of the interviewer, is also present at the interview.
Grandma, can you tell me about your parents and what life was like in the 1800s?
Tashima
Well, Mother and Father come over from Japan to San Francisco, and stay there after that. They had a little business for themselves and start family. They had one boy and one girl, myself and my older brother. And one more--oldest brother--they left in Japan.
P Tashima
Why did they leave your oldest brother in Japan?
Tashima
Because young couple don't know much about foreign country so they left their son there with Mother and Father.
P Tashima
Do you remember anything about what kind of business they had established in San Francisco?
Tashima
No, it was a hotel, that's all.
P Tashima
How soon after they came to the United States were you born?
Tashima
I was born January 2, 1896, in San Francisco.
P Tashima
Can you tell me about your early childhood? What it was like being raised here?
Well, I don't know anything about then. My parents took me back to Japan when I was two months old. I grew up in Japan and went to school there.
P Tashima
So you were educated in Japan?
Tashima
Yes.
P Tashima
When did you come back to America?
Tashima
I was sixteen years old.
P Tashima
Did your parents take the whole family back to Japan?
Tashima
Yes, but after that, a few years later, just Father come here. And Mother stay in Japan a couple of years. Then after that Father came back to America by himself and stop in San Francisco first and move to Los Angeles after that. So Mother, my brother and I came here, United States.
P Tashima
To Los Angeles?
Tashima
Yes, to Los Angeles, we stay.
P Tashima
Your oldest brother came over with your father, right?
Tashima
Yes. Already, before. Not that same time--ten, fifteen years later. School finished. Still, father call older brother. And after, he call again, our family.
P Tashima
Did you all help in the hotel business?
Tashima
Well, I don't help very well. I just girl, so did most of sewing and school studying.
P Tashima
Did you have any kind of American schooling?
Tashima
No, just home.
P Tashima
What did your father do in Japan before he came to America?
Tashima
Well, some kind of business, but I don't know very well. Father and Mother not married very long and come over. Both very young people.
P Tashima
How old were they?
Tashima
I guess, nineteen and seventeen, something like that. My parents both come from Samurai family, and not very much left, but then, all right living for enough. So they were thinking, "Come outside, see foreign country." And they would like stay in San Francisco.
Did your parents like America?
Tashima
Well, I imagine so. They start, you know, America. But I can hear, "I'm lonesome," thinking everyday about in Japan. So I want to go back again to Japan. Because I'm homesick. But little by little, everyday, feeling change, and I like this country very much.
P Tashima
How soon after you got to America did you meet Grandpa?
Tashima
Well, I met Grandpa in 1914.
P Tashima
Do you remember how you met him?
Tashima
Oh, yes. And we marry October 7, 1914.
P Tashima
Then did you move to Orange County?
Tashima
Yes, move to Orange County--Wintersburg.
P Tashima
What kind of business was Grandpa in then?
Tashima
Well, my husband in merchandise business. Everything, you know, grocery and . . .
P Tashima
Were you one of the first Japanese families in Wintersburg?
Tashima
No, no many people there already. Japanese. Many, not so many, but quite a few.
P Tashima
What was Orange County like back in the early 1900s?
Tashima
Oh, very good. Quiet. And all my children born in Wintersburg, same place. They live there, go to school, so I like it there very much.
P Tashima
Was Grandpa established in America when you met him?
Tashima
Yes. He came here earlier when he stayed in San Francisco and settled in Wintersburg, Orange County, and he had business start. Then he met me and marry. Start family, raise children.
P Tashima
Does anything stand out in your mind about Wintersburg?
Tashima
I feel so nice, happy. And people in my neighborhood so nice to me and my family. So glad.
P Tashima
How were you treated by the different people?
Tashima
Well, all nationalities very good friends to me. Come everyday and every night and speak with me. I was so happy.
P Tashima
What was it like raising a family then?
I had five sons and one daughter. Taking care of family and business. And times were so hard, very hard. But, I never give up--work, work, work. Finally, my children grow up. Then sometime, I had sickness. Spend two-and-a-half months in the hospital. Finally, getting better, little by little. It takes time, but healthy again.
P Tashima
This was with your fever?
Tashima
Typhoid fever.
P Tashima
But through it all you managed to raise your family, through the Depression?
Tashima
Yes. So hard, but so happy. All of them grow up. They take care of family now. Then my husband start illness and year by year getting worse. Passed away in 1959.
P Tashima
Do you know what the disease was?
Tashima
Parkinson's disease.
P Tashima
Do you remember what you were doing when you heard about the bombing of Pearl Harbor?
Tashima
Yes, 1941, morning around seven o'clock. We heard radio. My goodness. All of us standing up, "What happened?" All children speaking, I feel so upside-down. I don't know what to say. So shaking, shaking.
P Tashima
How old were your children?
Tashima
Nori was twenty-seven. He is second oldest son.
P Tashima
They were all old enough to realize what happened?
Tashima
Yes.
P Tashima
Did people treat you any differently after Pearl Harbor?
Tashima
No, my neighborhood so kind. Everything nicely speak, helping. I feel so thankful at that time. Before Pearl Harbor happened, we moved to Garden Grove. And after that, five miles . . .
P Tashima
They wouldn't let you go five miles away from your home?
Tashima
No. We can't go out.
P Tashima
And they put a curfew on you?
Tashima
Yes.
P Tashima
Did you resent that in anyway?
I can't do anything, just staying home. In nighttime, can't show light, so we close all windows.
P Tashima
What time was the curfew, do you remember?
Tashima
Most of the time. So scared. And just go out and come back right away.
P Tashima
So Grandma, the curfew was about eight at night, so you didn't go anywhere.
Tashima
I feel don't go anywhere.
P Tashima
When did you hear about the relocation orders?
Tashima
Beginning of May 1942. Packing one bag to put in clothes, and one plate each to eat; cup, knife, spoon, fork, that's all. Can carry just a few things. And May 15, I guess, send off to Arizona, by Army or government, I don't know.
P Tashima
What was your feeling then?
Tashima
Oh, I feel so scared. Everyone so scared, I imagine. I feel so scared, I don't know where I am going.
P Tashima
They didn't tell you.
Tashima
No. Get on train, close windows, don't speak nothing, just few words.
P Tashima
Didn't Grandpa leave before you did?
Tashima
Yes. Grandpa was taken by FBI--first time go to Tujunga. And after that New Mexico. That time, Grandpa was so ill.
P Tashima
Why was he taken before the rest of you?
Tashima
I don't know what happened. Grandpa, ten, fifteen years ago, was in Japanese Association--everything all, he quit. But someone, I don't know, I can't say, someone told.
P Tashima
He was active in a Japanese organization?
Tashima
Yes, I think so. There were groups that were picked up for saying and doing harsh things--starting little groups--but Grandpa was not picked up with those kind of people by FBI. He went with reverends, schoolteachers, professors, and doctors--that kind of people. They moved them all over without knowing where they were going. When he finally did reach the camp, they were all peaceful people.
P Tashima
Mom, could you clarify Grandma's last statement.
Grandpa was taken with a group that were very well educated; they were doctors, teachers, and reverends. And on the other hand, there was a group of rowdies that were rounded up, but he wasn't with that group. Grandma wanted to clarify that because he was affiliated with so many Japanese organizations.
P Tashima
Did you get to see Grandpa before you went to Arizona?
Tashima
Yes, we visit Tujunga, whole family. And next day, he was sent out. We didn't know where he was going.
P Tashima
Oh, they never told you where he was going?
Tashima
No.
P Tashima
What was his feeling when you talked to him in Tujunga?
Tashima
Well, scared and sad, but he didn't do any bad thing so, straight honest. Said, "Ask me, I want to answer."
M Tashima
Grandma is trying to tell you that he didn't have any guilt feelings about anything. He went willingly because he was taken. But he didn't do anything wrong. And that is what she is trying to convey. And had they asked him, he would have answered right away. Since he was never asked, he could never state his side.
P Tashima
Can you describe Poston, Grandma?
Tashima
Unhappy for awhile. It was so hot daytime; nighttime, very cold. In the morning, oh, so cold, we need one blanket. And sand--ground all sand. One step by step, sand all in shoes. Walk, walk, never have chance to ride. Everything by walk. But, oh, well, we worried. But we can't help. Stay here for awhile anyway. So change mind and obey everything, keep quiet, everybody was friendly; it's all right. Happier there. We think better stay here. But we want to go out.
P Tashima
You kind of felt safer in the camp?
Tashima
Yes. Not really happy, but we change mind thinking happy. And we don't do anything very much, just stay.
P Tashima
Do you remember how your children felt being without their father?
Tashima
Well, they worry about father. But not feeling any problem. They understand someday father would be home. So they writing letters. And letters come back. Answer. They open and inspect. They come back, word scratched off or dark mark. Tell them to be careful when they write.
P Tashima
Was it hard for children to adjust to camp life?
They don't like. Same year, two of sons go out. November 1942. And all boyfriends, graduate college together, so six boys go Colorado. And next year, spring, my oldest son, Uncle Hal, and Aunt Mary got married in camp.
P Tashima
Then did they go to Colorado?
Tashima
No, he stay several months. They left camp for Cleveland sometime in fall.
P Tashima
Who went to Colorado?
Tashima
Uncle Taky [third oldest son] and Uncle Masy [fourth oldest son]. And after that, Yasy, your father, my youngest boy, went . . . I don't remember where.
M Tashima
Yes, that's when her youngest son, your father, went to join them, in Colorado.
P Tashima
How soon after that was he inducted into the service?
Tashima
Taky and Yasy finished work on the farms in fall, then went to Cleveland and were inducted into the Army, I think.
M Tashima
Uncle Taky and your dad were inducted into the Army in Cleveland.
P Tashima
Then Uncle Masy went on to officer's school, right?
Tashima
He was going to school in Philadelphia where it was men only. But more and more started so he quit school and came back to Cleveland and joined the Army.
M Tashima
Uncle Masy was in a school in Philadelphia. Then he came back to Cleveland and he also joined the Army from Cleveland.
Tashima
That summer after working on the farm he went to Colorado and went to Greeley State College, now Colorado State College. Then from there he went to Philadelphia.
M Tashima
Uncle Masy graduated from Greeley College, and then he went to Philadelphia. He was continuing his education there when he was called into the Army. So he was inducted from Cleveland because that was their home base.
P Tashima
So he had to stop his education?
Tashima
Yes. Then when he returned from the Army, he went to Ohio State.
P Tashima
Then your second oldest son, Nori, had been drafted before the war started?
Tashima
Yes.
Where was he situated?
Tashima
Well, I received many letters from him overseas. But December 15, 1942, I received a telegram from Army. December 1, Noriyuki--I received letter, telegram saying Noriyuki Tashima was wounded in action in France. So, I feel so bad, I can't tell how. So sad. I cry and cry and cry.
P Tashima
Did he go to the camp once he came back to America?
Tashima
Yes, and he went to many hospitals around overseas. Year by and he came back United States in the summertime. So many wounds, but say it's all right.
P Tashima
Do you know what the wound was?
Tashima
Well, wound in three places, and he was discharged from Army with Purple Heart. He went to school.
P Tashima
Was he with the 442nd Regiment?
Tashima
No, not 442nd.
P Tashima
How did you feel being in camp while your son was fighting overseas?
Tashima
Oh, I can't tell how feeling. One time, third and fifth sons joined Army same morning and one other son next year, but by that time war already over. One son, Alaska. One son, Germany. One, France. One, Italy. All sons, different places. But everything all right, now, I imagine.
P Tashima
Did you think it was kind of unfair?
Tashima
Well, I can't tell how. Fate is so mixed-up sometime. Everything change quietly.
P Tashima
What did you do after getting out of camp?
Tashima
Went to Cleveland. My husband's illness--taking care of him. Busy.
P Tashima
As you look back, how do you view your whole experience?
Tashima
Well, not very sure. I don't like war. So many people sorry.
P Tashima
Do you feel any bitterness?
Tashima
At first, I was very surprised, I didn't know what to say. I didn't understand, but gradually my feelings became that America was doing this in the best interest for everybody's welfare. They felt sorry for us, but they had to do it. They couldn't help but put us in the camps for that time. We Japanese had to obey. We had to go for our own sake. That's what the government wanted us to understand--that it was for our safety. I understood
M Tashima
She did feel bitter at the beginning when it first happened--being uprooted. But as the days went by, they reconciled themselves to the fact that they must obey the laws of the land, and while they're living there, they're going to have to do what they're told. And so they went with a very strong feeling that they're going to overcome the hardships. By the time they were beginning to close the camps up, they felt like they should stay there.
P Tashima
Grandma, were your feelings ever divided between Japan and America?
Tashima
Well, I lived in Japan so long, but I am so glad stay here. Of course, in Japan is all right--beautiful, I like. But if I want to stay, my life be in America. This is my country, so warm feeling.
P Tashima
Did you have any family in Japan when the war was going on?
Tashima
Yes. My husband Tashima's family in Japan.
P Tashima
Were you able to communicate with them?
Tashima
No, not during war. Peacetime write letters and I visit them soon. We go to Japan two years ago. We met first time. So happy. But when I stay my life, come back here. Visiting all right, beautiful in Japan. Very nice. They want to come back. Someday visit again, I hope.
P Tashima
What are your sons doing now?
Tashima
My oldest son, Hiroyuki [Hal], he's working North American Aviation. And second son, Noriyuki [Nori], he serves post office, postmaster. And third son, Takayuki [Taky], passed away about five years ago. Fourth son, Masayuki [Masy], is working Gray Drugs. Company in Ohio. Fifth son, Yoshiyuki [Yasy], working Alpha Beta Markets.
P Tashima
And your daughter?
Tashima
Daughter's husband [Shira] is working as engineer with company in Ohio. Kimi, my daughter is helping in school, summertime. All children and grandchildren, I am so happy. I am happy, especially.
P Tashima
Grandma, would you like to add anything?
Tashima
Noriyuki he was the first Japanese postmaster in the Continental
M Tashima
He's a linguist. He speaks three different languages.
Tashima
Well, ending, my life was so happy but very busy, busy one. But children and grandchildren so happy, too. So glad.
P Tashima
I'd like to thank you for the interview, Grandma, both for myself and the California State University, Fullerton, Japanese American Oral History Project.
Index
- Alaska, United States Territory of, 8
- Arizona, State of, 5, 6
- Attitudes,
- Cleveland, Ohio, 7, 8
- Colorado, State of, 7
- Depression, [the Great], 4
- Federal Bureau of Investigation [FBI], arrest and incarceration, 5-6
- France, 8
- Germany, 8
- Greeley State College [Colorado State College], 7
- Hotel Industry, 1, 2
- Immigration, 1, 2
- Italy, 8
- Japan, 1, 2, 3, 9
- Japanese Americans, 1-10
- Japanese Association, 5
- Kennedy, President John F., 10
- Los Angeles, California, 2
- New Mexico, State of, 5
- Ohio State University, 7
- Parkinson's disease, 4
- Pearl Harbor, bombing of, 4
- Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, 7
- Poston War Relocation Center, 6
- Relocation, 5, 6
- Retail Marketing Industry, 3
- Samurai, 2
- San Francisco, California, 1, 2, 3
- Shira, Kimi, 4, 9
- Tashima, Hiroyuki [Hal], 7, 9
- Tashima, Masako Yagi,
- Tashima, Masayuki [Masy], 7, 9
- Tashima, Noriyuki [Nori], 1, 4, 7, 8, 9, 10
- Tashima, Takayuki [Taky], 7, 9
- Tashima, Yoshiyuki [Yasy], 7, 9
- Tujunga, California, 5, 6
- Typhoid Fever, 4
- United States Army, 5, 7, 8
- Wintersburg, California, 3
Title: Tashima (Masako) - Japanese American Evacuation
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