Jump to Content

Collection Guide
Collection Title:
Collection Number:
Get Items:
Register of the Firing Line (Television Program) broadcast records
80040  
View entire collection guide What's This?
PDF (2.94 Mb) HTML
Search this collection
 
 
Table of contents What's This?
2 of 2 pages
Results page: |<< Previous Next >>|
Program Number S0966, 2234

"Are We Doing Enough in Bosnia?"

Guests: Rosenblatt, Lionel. : Soros, George.

27 April 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 4
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 13
Program details: The answer, from guests and host alike, is a resounding "No". As Serbian strongman Slobodan Milosevic gained strength, NATO dithered, refusing even to lift the arms embargo on Bosnia. This show offers a remarkably prescient discussion of the possibilities. WFB: "Are you philosophically resolved to oppose any military venture that is not conclusive?" GS: "I personally am not." WFB: "I'm not either." GS: "I think it's a mistake of military doctrine if you look for victory in a situation where it's not really victory that you're seeking--it's interdiction." ... LR: "What we have are civilians who've been targeted en masse, driven from their homes, forced to leave areas they've inhabited for generations. I won't split hairs as to whether this is genocide or not, but it's a war against civilians."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1225
Program Number S0967, 2235

"The Real Anita Hill"

Guests: Brock, David, 1962-

27 April 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 5
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 13
Program details: WFB starts out by telling us that "Mr. Warren Steibel, the producer of Firing Line, invited not only Miss Hill to appear on this program, but also three of her heartiest advocates ... Everyone invited pleaded conflicting engagements, and so we proceed with Mr. Brock." It would have been a more dramatic show, certainly, if the woman who had accused Clarence Thomas of sexual harassment had taken part; but Mr. Brock is as clear an exponent in person as he is in print, and he reminds us of salient points concerning the Judiciary Committee's hearings on Judge Thomas's nomination to the Supreme Court. DB: "In my view, most of Anita Hill's supporters would find that almost everything they believe about this case and about Anita Hill is actually false.... We can go right to the question of: The men on the Committee just didn't get it. That is provably false, and I lay out the scenario in my book to show that the Committee actually did ... everything that it could have been expected to do to take the charge seriously."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1226
Program Number S0968, 2236

"An Approach to Illegitimacy"

Guests: Blankenhorn, David.

27 April 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 13
Program details: As Mr. Buckley points out, the rising rate of illegitimacy (17 per cent among whites currently, 62 per cent among blacks) is an issue not only morally, but also in terms of its fostering other pathologies--crime, illiteracy, drug use. Mr. Blankenhorn is earnest rather than sparkling, but he has a lot to say. "In our interviews we've found the most severe critics of the current welfare system to be the people who are on it. They'll tell you in unequivocal terms that it is a pretty terrible thing, and they'll tell you that one of the terrible things about it is that it's part of a system that effectively keeps men out of family life."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1227
Program Number S0969, 2237

"The Dangers of Overpopulation"

Guests: Abernethy, Virginia. : Bartley, Robert.

19 May 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 7
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 14
Program details: Mr. Bartley really believes in open immigration: WFB: "You can't imagine a situation in which everybody who wanted to come to America could just plain come, because it would give us a social overhead that we simply couldn't stand. Won't you begin your generality by accepting an empirical limit on it?" RB: "Not as an ideal." Dr. Abernethy comes along with a bucket of cold water: "Remember, Hong Kong may be much closer to a libertarian society than we are.... We have a government that has undertaken to provide health care, food stamps, subsidized housing, cash payments in the form of Aid to Families with Dependent Children, plus public education... So if we are libertarian in implementing just one policy, and that policy is open borders, we become a welfare magnet for the whole world." And we're off and running on a stimulating and useful debate.
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1228
Program Number S0970, 2238

"The Global Crisis"

Guests: Brzezinski, Zbigniew, 1928-

19 May 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 8
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 14
Program details: A magnificent look at a dark and brooding canvas: the former East Bloc's attempt to find a new equilibrium. ZB: "If 'Never again' has any moral imperative attached to it, it has to be applied to new circumstances.... If 'Never again' means only that it is applicable if Hitler appears and there are Nazis with swastikas killing Jews in Kristallnacht and thereafter in Germany, then it's never going to happen again. So there is a moral obligation here [in Bosnia]. After all, this is happening in what is considered to be the more civilized part of the world. If legality and decency collapse there, the implications of that are far more consequent than if it happens in those parts of the world where violence is more pervasive and legality is less entrenched." "The great struggle today in Russia is really not between democrats and Communists. It's between those Russians, like Yeltsin, who say that Russia ought to be a normal, post-imperial national state, and those who say: 'No, inherent in the notion of being a Russian is an imperial mission.'"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1229
Program Number S0971, 2239

"Is Philosophy Worthwhile?"

Guests: Adler, Mortimer Jerome, 1902-2001.

19 May 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 9
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 14
Program details: Mr. Adler is more abstract than usual, and the conversation suffers for it. But there are still passages that are not to be missed: MA: "Don't you think it's extraordinary that before Kant there were no idealists at all? Not one ever denied a noble reality, an intelligible reality. Kant's Copernican revolution is the worst disaster that's happened to philosophy in modern times, and the professional philosophers accept it without a murmur." WFB: "How do you account for that?" MA: "I'm afraid I have to say something that's cruel. I think they're uneducated. They have not submitted their mind to the literature properly. They haven't read Aristotle properly, they haven't read Aquinas properly, they haven't read Plato properly."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1230
Program Number S0972, 2301

"What Is Liberal Education?"

Guests: Kennan, Elizabeth T. : Agresto, John. : West, Cornel.

11 June 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 15
Program details: Our guests approach the title questions obliquely but profoundly, getting at what liberal education is and who should receive it by talking about how liberal education is done. JA: "One reason to be at almost every moment more on the side of free inquiry than not is that the texts we tend to teach, especially the older texts, tend to be rather countercultural, tend to be rather disconcerting. And I would not want someone to say, 'We're not teaching that warmonger Homer; we're not going to allow that racist Aristotle, and we won't allow that narrow-minded bigot Christ to be in our curriculum.'" WFB: "Well, you're citing examples that make your case rather easy. Suppose somebody were to say: 'You know, when you come down to it, Adolf Hitler had some damned interesting things to say, and under the circumstances, I want to expose all of my students to Mein Kampf and to a body of Nazi literature.'"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1231
Program Number S0973, 2302

"Who Should Be Liberally Educated?"

Guests: Kennan, Elizabeth T. : Agresto, John. : West, Cornel.

11 June 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 11
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 15
Program details: Our guests approach the title questions obliquely but profoundly, getting at what liberal education is and who should receive it by talking about how liberal education is done. JA: "One reason to be at almost every moment more on the side of free inquiry than not is that the texts we tend to teach, especially the older texts, tend to be rather countercultural, tend to be rather disconcerting. And I would not want someone to say, 'We're not teaching that warmonger Homer; we're not going to allow that racist Aristotle, and we won't allow that narrow-minded bigot Christ to be in our curriculum.'" WFB: "Well, you're citing examples that make your case rather easy. Suppose somebody were to say: 'You know, when you come down to it, Adolf Hitler had some damned interesting things to say, and under the circumstances, I want to expose all of my students to Mein Kampf and to a body of Nazi literature."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1232
Program Number S0974, 2303

"Why Does College Cost So Much?"

Guests: Zemsky, Robert.

11 June 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 12
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 15
Program details: Like the previous two shows, this one was taped at a convention entitled Excellence in Undergraduate Education. There are several college presidents in the audience, and some of them accept Mr. Buckley's invitation to break in with questions and comments, bringing other perspectives to an already lively show. The question before the house is why, since 1980, the cost of college tuition has risen, as WFB puts it, "at twice the rate of overall inflation and higher even than medical inflation." RZ: "All the data says that if you want a robust earnings over your lifetime, go to college. There is just no doubt about that. And that's the good news. The other side of it is public policymakers have said, 'If that's true, then let them pay for it.'"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1233
Program Number S0975, 2304

"The Class of '93 with Honors"

Guests: Duncan, Martin L. : Hamrick, C. Leigh. : Seidman, Jeffrey S.

11 June 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 13
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 16
Program details: Unlike our last visit with a panel of students (see Firing Line s0842), which yielded, as the deepest concern of today's students, Tuition increase," these three brand-new graduates talk about things like "the social, moral, and spiritual implications of what a liberal-arts education means" (Mr. Duncan) and the perception that "after four years of reading Hegel and Kant and Flannery O'Connor and talking about them," a quite "ordinary group of students" had become "an extraordinary group of people in their interests and in their ability to carry on a conversation" (Mr. Seidman). And Miss Hamrick, a la Mortimer Adler, reminds us that "the mission of a liberal-arts school is not to fill someone's head up with all the knowledge that is there; it's to instill a thirst for knowledge and the techniques of learning." A refreshing session indeed with three products of modern liberal education.
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1234
Program Number S0976, 2305

"Are Prisons Serving Their Purpose?"

Guests: Colson, Charles W.

27 July 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 14
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 16
Program details: We have met Mr. Colson here before, and, no, he has not changed his views about, as he puts it, "the insanity of taking non-violent offenders and separate[ing] them out from society, break[ing] them away from their families, stop[ping] them from being the breadwinners." But this show offers a particularly rich exposition, not least because Mr. Colson had just visited a prison in Brazil that truly rehabilitates, sending out people with a recidivism rate of about 4 per cent. The catch: it's explicitly Christian. CC: "Jack Eckerd, a wonderful philanthropist, spent half a million dollars to explore the feasibility of doing it here and concluded, because of the ACLU and separation of church and state, that we would never be able to do it." WFB: "You mean they might fall in love with God instead of with Mammon, and we wouldn't want to run that risk?" CC: "Well, we might offend someone by suggesting that there is such a thing as truth or Christian values that can transform a person's life. That would be offensive in today's tolerant society."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1235
Program Number S0977, 2306

"Mortgages and the American Economy"

Guests: Brendsel, Leland.

27 July 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 15
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 16
Program details: One of the most adversarial one-on-one Firing Lines we've had in a while--which unfortunately doesn't make it easy for the uninitiated viewer to grasp exactly in what sense Freddie Mac (Federal Home Loan Mortgage Corporation) and his sister, Fannie Mae (the Federal National Mortgage Association), are private, and in what sense they are, as Mr. Buckley puts it, "adopted children of the Federal Government." Are we indeed facing a reprise of the Sand L mess? Mr. Brendsel says not and gives details to back up his assertion. As he explains, although taxpayers' money is involved in Freddie Mac, it is only temporarily so for each mortgage: what Freddie Mac does is buy up mortgages at the low end of the housing market from private-sector lenders, combine a bunch of them from different parts of the country in a diversified package, and sell these "mortgage-backed securities" to private investors. As of this writing, Mr. Brendsel's expectations have been borne out.
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1236
Program Number S0978, 2307

"A Backstage Look at Dictionaries"

Guests: Mish, Frederick P.

27 July 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 16
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 17
Program details: The "dictionary wars" had erupted regularly ever since the appearance, in 1961, of Webster's Third International (the unabridged dictionary of which Mr. Mish's Collegiates are the offspring), and WFB, as a well-known consumer of dictionaries, had been an active combatant. The main point at issue: ought "a dictionary to exercise any normative functions"? Mr. Mish answers ably, but this show proves far richer than a mere tussle over "ain't" and "hopefully." WFB: "I remember years ago reading that when Ronald Knox translated the New Testament he took 13 different Greek words and conjoined them all into the single word 'righteous.' In doing so, I was told by this particular critic, he set back ethical research by two thousand years. Now, if there is not a felt need for a gradation of a word, do you rule that the time has come to jettison it? ..." FPM: "We wouldn't jettison anything if it were still in common use or if it had been used in important literary works of the past. You can't take a word out of a dictionary that calls itself 'collegiate' if Shakespeare used it in Hamlet, even if no one has used it since Hamlet."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1237
Program Number S0979, 2308

"The Threat of Nuclear Destruction in the New World Order-New Voices-Part I"

Guests: Kissinger, Henry, 1923- : Feith, Douglas. : Seitz, Russell. : Sokolski, Henry.

16 August 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 17
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 17
Program details: An extraordinarily rich trio of shows on various aspects of nuclear proliferation. Some samples: RS: "One of the principal exports of the United States over the last two generations has been perhaps the most dangerous and hazardous of all strategic materials.... We've been exporting tons of human minds, fully educated in the applied sciences and engineering, literally by the thousands." ... DF: "There's an analysis that a country will go through about whether it benefits itself to go nuclear. One could argue that there's a lot of physics involved but there's a lot of metaphysics involved also.... Many countries that for decades have had the capability and the materials and the engineering know-how have chosen not to go nuclear." ... HK: "We have a delicate problem because on the one hand we do not want to stigmatize the degree to which we are relying on nuclear weapons. On the other hand we clearly have an interest that nuclear weapons do not spread widely."... HS: "The question that you need to focus more on is: How much do you want to share what is essentially missile technology? Just saying 'defense' in front of it doesn't help-you can also use these things offensively."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1238
Program Number S0980, 2309

"The Threat of Nuclear Destruction in the New World Order-New Voices-Part II"

Guests: Kissinger, Henry, 1923- : Feith, Douglas. : Seitz, Russell. : Sokolski, Henry.

16 August 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 18
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 17
Program details: An extraordinarily rich trio of shows on various aspects of nuclear proliferation. Some samples: RS: "One of the principal exports of the United States over the last two generations has been perhaps the most dangerous and hazardous of all strategic materials.... We've been exporting tons of human minds, fully educated in the applied sciences and engineering, literally by the thousands." ... DF: "There's an analysis that a country will go through about whether it benefits itself to go nuclear. One could argue that there's a lot of physics involved but there's a lot of metaphysics involved also.... Many countries that for decades have had the capability and the materials and the engineering know-how have chosen not to go nuclear." ... HK: "We have a delicate problem because on the one hand we do not want to stigmatize the degree to which we are relying on nuclear weapons. On the other hand we clearly have an interest that nuclear weapons do not spread widely."... HS: "The question that you need to focus more on is: How much do you want to share what is essentially missile technology? Just saying 'defense' in front of it doesn't help-you can also use these things offensively."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1239
Program Number S0981, 2310

"The Threat of Nuclear Destruction in the New World Order-New Voices-Part III"

Guests: Kissinger, Henry, 1923- : Feith, Douglas. : Seitz, Russell. : Sokolski, Henry.

16 August 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 19
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 18
Program details: An extraordinarily rich trio of shows on various aspects of nuclear proliferation. Some samples: RS: "One of the principal exports of the United States over the last two generations has been perhaps the most dangerous and hazardous of all strategic materials.... We've been exporting tons of human minds, fully educated in the applied sciences and engineering, literally by the thousands." ... DF: "There's an analysis that a country will go through about whether it benefits itself to go nuclear. One could argue that there's a lot of physics involved but there's a lot of metaphysics involved also.... Many countries that for decades have had the capability and the materials and the engineering know-how have chosen not to go nuclear." ... HK: "We have a delicate problem because on the one hand we do not want to stigmatize the degree to which we are relying on nuclear weapons. On the other hand we clearly have an interest that nuclear weapons do not spread widely."... HS: "The question that you need to focus more on is: How much do you want to share what is essentially missile technology? Just saying 'defense' in front of it doesn't help-you can also use these things offensively."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1240
Program Number S0982, 2311

"Collections"

Guests: Zion, Sidney. : Leonard, John, 1939-

16 August 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 20
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 18
Program details: In this delightfully offbeat show (the title refers to collections of journalistic writing), three veterans trade stories about publishers, other authors, and the promotion circuit. SZ: "I do know authors who would be quite embarrassed to have their works collected. Sometimes I think the way to get even with some of these political savants is to publish their collection of columns over the years. I don't know that they could survive it." ... JL: "I deplore the takeover of the book-publishing business by people who want to make money.... There's obviously nothing wrong with trying to make money. I just don't know why you'd want to go into the book business to make money, because you're dealing with unrepeatable products most of the time."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1241
Program Number S0983

"The Religious Right Argument"

Guests: Kinsley, Michael E. : Hyde, Henry J. : Neusner, Jacob, 1932- : Woods, Harriett. : Glasser, Ira. : West, Cornel. : Lynn, Barry W.

9 September 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 21
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 18
Program details: The third installment of a new Firing Line format, in which a formal debate is followed by informal discussion. As with the earlier such pair of shows (on the deficit, s0952 and s0953, and on women in combat, s0961 and s0962), the only drawback is that the argument, released from the constraints of formal debate, is almost too vigorous. But there are fine exchanges. MK: "Suppose a parent decides: I'm going to take my voucher and send my child to a school that teaches devil worship, or the Branch Davidians, or something like that. Is there no type of education chosen by a parent that would offend you-- that would cause you to say: 'I don't want my tax dollars going for teaching that'?" WFB: "It would offend me, yes, but most of the way money is spent offends me." MK: "Would it offend you to the point where you would say: I don't want my tax dollars going to that?" JN: "We don't get to say that very often. When we tried to raise that issue with federal funds for the arts and we tried to explain to people that we didn't think there should be federal funding of anti-religious or anti-Christian propaganda, people answered us and they said: You don't get to make those decisions." MK: "Well, here's your chance to be consistent."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1243
Program Number S0984

"The Religious Right or Wrong?"

Guests: Kinsley, Michael E. : Hyde, Henry J. : Neusner, Jacob, 1932- : Woods, Harriett. : Glasser, Ira. : West, Cornel. : Lynn, Barry W.

9 September 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 21
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 19
Program details: The third installment of a new Firing Line format, in which a formal debate is followed by informal discussion. As with the earlier such pair of shows (on the deficit, s0952 and s0953, and on women in combat, s0961 and s0962), the only drawback is that the argument, released from the constraints of formal debate, is almost too vigorous. But there are fine exchanges. MK: "Suppose a parent decides: I'm going to take my voucher and send my child to a school that teaches devil worship, or the Branch Davidians, or something like that. Is there no type of education chosen by a parent that would offend you-- that would cause you to say: 'I don't want my tax dollars going for teaching that'?" WFB: "It would offend me, yes, but most of the way money is spent offends me." MK: "Would it offend you to the point where you would say: I don't want my tax dollars going to that?" JN: "We don't get to say that very often. When we tried to raise that issue with federal funds for the arts and we tried to explain to people that we didn't think there should be federal funding of anti-religious or anti-Christian propaganda, people answered us and they said: You don't get to make those decisions." MK: "Well, here's your chance to be consistent."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1244
Program Number S0985, 2314

"National Security after the Cold War"

Guests: Rostow, Eugene V. (Eugene Victor), 1913-

22 September 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 22
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 19
Program details: Professor Rostow's current book, Toward Managed Peace, argued that our need actively to pursue our national-security interests had by no means evaporated with the end of the Cold War. The events of the day before this taping--Boris Yeltsin had dismissed the Russian Duma--certainly bore him out. This thoughtful discussion ranges from the current fiasco in Yugoslavia--where neither the United Nations nor NATO was able to put an end to Slobodan Milosevic's "ethnic cleansing"--to "the major diplomatic mistake of the 20th century--and that's a field that has a great many major diplomatic mistakes ... : the 1918-1919-1920 period in Russia when we should have helped, obviously on a very large scale, the promising new democratic regime of Prince Lvov and Kerensky to succeed. The Allies, exhausted by the First War, made a few feeble gestures and then retreated and allowed this cancerous development of the Soviet regime to take place."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1245
Program Number S0986, 2315

"The Abolition of the Moral Sense"

Guests: Wilson, James Q.

22 September 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 23
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 19
Program details: Mr. Buckley directs the discussion towards illegitimacy and the family, and Professor Wilson takes it from there, in a vigorous half-hour that goes from the need to socialize young males ("I can speak with some confidence on this matter because I was a young male at one time, and I know what my mind was on most of the time") to the difficulty with political speech ("Political leaders in this country speak to two audiences. The first audience is the constituency, the people they hope will vote for them, and the second is that audience of the elite, the media, the intellectuals... And since much of what the average voter understands about them as candidates is a second-hand reflection in this two-step flow of influence . . . they hedge their bets. They only speak enthusiastically when they know the media audience and their voting constituency are in agreement, such as: Unemployment is bad").
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1246
Program Number S0987, 2316

"A Mini-Debate about Health Care: Part I: Politics"

Guests: Goodman, John C. : Cooper, Jim. : Paris, Jackson. : Gramm, Phil. : Stark, Pete. : Zelman, Walter.

18 October 1993

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 1
Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 24
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 20
Program details: The nation was about halfway through the twenty-month-long marathon on health-care reform that had been set in motion by President and Mrs. Clinton. This group of debaters faithfully reflects the range (if not every possible shade) of opinion on the question, and so, despite the hopeful adjuration of Rep. Cooper ("Democrats and Republicans have been fighting for half a century on this issue. Now is the time to come together in common agreement on what will work, what will be good medicine back home for all"), there can be no consensus. But there's plenty to think about in these two half-hours. PS: "I've got the only plan that works, and that's Medicare. And none of the people here would call that socialism or vote against it." PG: "It's just paying for it is the problem." PS: "And the seniors love it. All the seniors love it. The doctors like it. The hospitals survive with it." JF: "And it's about to bankrupt the country."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1248
Program Number S0988, 2317

"A Mini-Debate about Health Care: Part II: The Best Plan"

Guests: Goodman, John C. : Cooper, Jim. : Paris, Jackson. : Gramm, Phil. : Stark, Pete. : Zelman, Walter.

18 October 1993

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 1
Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 34
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 20
Program details: The nation was about halfway through the twenty-month-long marathon on health-care reform that had been set in motion by President and Mrs. Clinton. This group of debaters faithfully reflects the range (if not every possible shade) of opinion on the question, and so, despite the hopeful adjuration of Rep. Cooper ("Democrats and Republicans have been fighting for half a century on this issue. Now is the time to come together in common agreement on what will work, what will be good medicine back home for all"), there can be no consensus. But there's plenty to think about in these two half-hours. PS: "I've got the only plan that works, and that's Medicare. And none of the people here would call that socialism or vote against it." PG: "It's just paying for it is the problem." PS: "And the seniors love it. All the seniors love it. The doctors like it. The hospitals survive with it." JF: "And it's about to bankrupt the country."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1249
Program Number S0989, 2318

"A Mini-Debate about Health Care: Part III: Quality Care"

Guests: Goodman, John C. : Dresing, Robert Kenneth. : Pollack, Ronald. : Rockefeller, Jay. : Sanders, Charles A. : Wellstone, Paul.

18 October 1993

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 1
Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 25
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 20
Program details: Yes, there's still more to say; these installments look at the subject more from the patient's and the doctor's point of view than the politician's. CAS: "The thing that concerns me ... is that there is no clear recognition of the need to support research and development. We are very concerned about taking care of people, but... if we don't have those medicines that are going to take care of AIDS and Alzheimer's and cancer and cardiovascular disease, then our kids aren't going to look to a very bright future." ... RKD: "The problem with doing an overhaul to a system that doesn't have every aspect of it broken is that we're going to have to break some of the things that don't need fixing. We have the best system in the world in this country.... Every one of you has had the experience of traveling to another country and you pray that you don't get sick."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1250
Program Number S0990, 2319

"A Mini-Debate about Health Care: Part IV: Choice"

Guests: Goodman, John C. : Dresing, Robert Kenneth. : Pollack, Ronald. : Rockefeller, Jay. : Sanders, Charles A. : Wellstone, Paul.

18 October 1993

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 1
Publicity File: Box/Folder 136 : 25
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 21
Program details: Yes, there's still more to say; these installments look at the subject more from the patient's and the doctor's point of view than the politician's. CAS: "The thing that concerns me ... is that there is no clear recognition of the need to support research and development. We are very concerned about taking care of people, but... if we don't have those medicines that are going to take care of AIDS and Alzheimer's and cancer and cardiovascular disease, then our kids aren't going to look to a very bright future." ... RKD: "The problem with doing an overhaul to a system that doesn't have every aspect of it broken is that we're going to have to break some of the things that don't need fixing. We have the best system in the world in this country.... Every one of you has had the experience of traveling to another country and you pray that you don't get sick."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1251
Program Number S0991, 2320

"Has Liberalism Generated an Underclass?"

Guests: Magnet, Myron.

22 September 1993

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 137 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 21
Program details: Mr. Magnet's latest book, The Dream and the Nightmare: The Sixties' Legacy to the Underclass, posits, as Mr. Buckley starts by telling us, "that the persistent problems of the underclass are owing not to economic factors but to a new culture," defined not only by the Woodstock Nation but also by "such as Michael Harrington and Norman Mailer and R. D. Laing." Mr. Magnet takes it from there: "The great magic of America is that we rest not on any kind of racial identity, not on the history of a single people, but on the great American liberal democratic idea. And it is being so devalued by talk of how we have a culture which victimizes people, which oppresses people, the thought that all those American values are elitist and racist or sexist... I think what we need to do is restore what was the unique American idea... that anybody who relies on himself, is energetic, will work, and will take care of his family, can be anything he wants to."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1247
Program Number S0992, 2321

"Will Deficit Reduction Backfire in 1994 and Beyond?"

Guests: Moynihan, Daniel P. (Daniel Patrick), 1927-2003. : Kemp, Jack. : Regan, Edward V. : Peterson, Peter G. : Levy, David A.

15 December 1993

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 4
Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 22
Program details: How worried should we be? None of our guests are inclined to sit back and worry. Whether they're optimists or pessimists, they're out there fighting--and giving, often, diametrically opposed advices. PGP: "This raises not only a serious long-term economic problem . . . but really a serious moral problem, because we are passing horrendous debts and deficits and tax rates to our children." ER: "Who says we need Pete and others to reduce the deficit to zero? ... Doesn't every household have virtually a permanent mortgage? Doesn't every business borrow a little? What's the idea that all of a sudden we've got to go totally clean and do it all at once?" JK: "It's single-entry book-keeping to look at deficit and debt without looking at the size of the pie. ... So I would like to focus ... on how to get the economy growing and the size of the pie. And that means, in my view, getting the high tax rate down." ... DL: "Economists have this notion that history began in 1947 when the national product account, GDP, and other statistics became available.... But a longer view of history says that capitalist economics--and I am a firm capitalist--do not grow smoothly."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1258
Program Number S0993, 2322

"The Economic Outlook for 1994 and Beyond"

Guests: Moynihan, Daniel P. (Daniel Patrick), 1927-2003. : Kemp, Jack. : Regan, Edward V. : Peterson, Peter G. : Levy, David A.

15 December 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 3
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 22
Program details: How worried should we be? None of our guests are inclined to sit back and worry. Whether they're optimists or pessimists, they're out there fighting--and giving, often, diametrically opposed advices. PGP: "This raises not only a serious long-term economic problem . . . but really a serious moral problem, because we are passing horrendous debts and deficits and tax rates to our children." ER: "Who says we need Pete and others to reduce the deficit to zero? ... Doesn't every household have virtually a permanent mortgage? Doesn't every business borrow a little? What's the idea that all of a sudden we've got to go totally clean and do it all at once?" JK: "It's single-entry book-keeping to look at deficit and debt without looking at the size of the pie. ... So I would like to focus ... on how to get the economy growing and the size of the pie. And that means, in my view, getting the high tax rate down." ... DL: "Economists have this notion that history began in 1947 when the national product account, GDP, and other statistics became available.... But a longer view of history says that capitalist economics--and I am a firm capitalist--do not grow smoothly."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1255
Program Number S0994, 2323

"Accumulating Wealth and Reducing Poverty in 1994 and Beyond"

Guests: Moynihan, Daniel P. (Daniel Patrick), 1927-2003. : Kemp, Jack. : Regan, Edward V. : Quinn, Jane Bryant. : Cohen, Dian.

15 December 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 4
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 23
Program details: Two new voices and a different set of topics keep this second installment of deficit talk moving right along. ER: "Deficit spending elects politicians. Whatever you might say about it in terms of... its impact on the economy,... if a politician can spend more than they tax, then they have distributed more gain than pain and then they assume the voters will react in kind and they will get themselves re-elected." ... DPM: "The deficit, regardless of the economic impact you can say it has or doesn't have, has a political impact that causes levels of anxiety.... There is no tax 'break' in the code better than employer-aided educational assistance.... We have to fight every year to keep it because of the deficit." ... JBQ: "I think it's quite remarkable in fact that we have had two doses of deficit reduction in three years in terms of tax increases, spending cuts ... and people have more or less taken it. I mean, there are a lot of miserable people out there, but they are buying into the short-term pain for the long-term gain. The question is, How long will they last?"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1256
Program Number S0995, 2324

"The Politics of the Deficit in 1994 and Beyond"

Guests: Moynihan, Daniel P. (Daniel Patrick), 1927-2003. : Kemp, Jack. : Regan, Edward V. : Quinn, Jane Bryant. : Cohen, Dian.

15 December 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 5
Transcript: Box/Folder 185 : 23
Program details: Two new voices and a different set of topics keep this second installment of deficit talk moving right along. ER: "Deficit spending elects politicians. Whatever you might say about it in terms of... its impact on the economy,... if a politician can spend more than they tax, then they have distributed more gain than pain and then they assume the voters will react in kind and they will get themselves re-elected." ... DPM: "The deficit, regardless of the economic impact you can say it has or doesn't have, has a political impact that causes levels of anxiety.... There is no tax 'break' in the code better than employer-aided educational assistance.... We have to fight every year to keep it because of the deficit." ... JBQ: "I think it's quite remarkable in fact that we have had two doses of deficit reduction in three years in terms of tax increases, spending cuts ... and people have more or less taken it. I mean, there are a lot of miserable people out there, but they are buying into the short-term pain for the long-term gain. The question is, How long will they last?"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1257
Program Number S0996, 2325

"Afterthoughts on Political Correctness"

Guests: Glasser, Ira. : Stimpson, Catharine R., 1936- : Greene, Linda. : Green, Mark J. : Botstein, Leon. : West, Cornel.

3 December 1993

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 101 : 10
Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 1
Program details: Although this show and the following one were taped immediately after the formal debate on political correctness, their airing was postponed in order to slip in the deficit shows as Congress was reconvening. As with all of these follow-ups so far, the informal discussion is even livelier than the debate. LB: "There is on the campus and in the nation as a whole a very brittle sensibility. There is no tolerance, there is no humor. There is a deadly self-righteousness and a vulgarity.... I think we agree that the university has to try to lift the standard of behavior. Whether it's one of tolerance, whether it's one of the way we talk, it's whether we actually know what it means to take a joke and not to make it a battle cry." ... CS: "I would say that the college and university ought to be better than the rest of society ... The college and university should show the meaning of freedom of speech."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1253
Program Number S0997, 2326

"Speech Codes on Campus"

Guests: Ahrens, Richard. : Blount, Ericka. : Cardona, Richard. : Kane, Danielle. : Krych, Meredith. : Pitt, Jonathan. : Reese, James. : Schwartz, Alec.

3 December 1993

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 7
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 1
Program details: The idea was to get the views of a group of the people to whom campus speech codes are applied. However, even though (or perhaps because) Penn was a PC battleground, these students are mostly quite circumspect and their accounts are lacking in detail--but with a few good moments. Mr. Pitt: "I've got the feeling that if one was a conservative Catholic attempting to express views of pro-life or any of a number of views, one would encounter a lot more resistance, and institutional resistance, than if one was promoting, say, a liberal Democratic agenda."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1254
Program Number S0998, 2327

"Are We Neglecting Primary Care?"

Guests: Janeway, Richard. : Bowman, Marjorie A. : Davis, Jeffrey. : Collins, Inge.

26 January 1994

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 6
Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 8
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 2
Program details: This is the first of four shows taped at the Bowman Gray School of Medicine at Wake Forest University, Winston-Salem, NC as the debate on the Clintons' health-care package was entering a new congressional year. Firing Line's previous look at health-care reform (Firing Line s0987-s0990) concentrated on the public policy and political aspects. This series, with an array of thoughtful and cogent guests, concentrates on medical aspects--in this first show, the relative paucity of general practitioners. Dr. Davis: "For me, being an internist meant a variety of things, one of which was intellectual satisfaction in diagnosis, problem-solving, which is one of the traditional hallmarks of internal medicine. But how I found that was in medical school, being exposed to a group of people who practiced medicine." ... Dr. Bowman on the possibility of retraining: "A neurosurgeon who has always been a neurosurgeon I perceive as having more difficulty becoming a primary-care physician than an infectious-disease specialist, for example."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1259
Program Number S0999, 2328

"Are Medical Costs Controllable?"

Guests: Janeway, Richard. : Kurad, J. Ward. : Sanders, Charles A.

26 January 1994

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 7
Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 9
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 2
Program details: "Yes!" is our guests' resounding answer to the title question--and without unmaking what is generally agreed to be the world's finest health-care system (CS: "One of the best things about the Canadian system is the proximity to the U.S."). Drs. Sanders and Janeway emphasize portability (the ability to retain your medical insurance if you change jobs) and insurance for catastrophic illness--which, says Dr. Janeway, could be taken care of for "not a huge amount of cost to the American public per year." Dr. Kurad--who was driven out of active practice of his specialty by "the paperwork mill and the hassles with insurance and Medicare"--tells persuasively what business can do to cut the red tape."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1260
Program Number S1000, 2329

"Should We Let Old People Die?"

Guests: Hazzard, William. : Longino, Charles. : Hall, Mark.

27 January 1994

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 8
Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 3
Program details: In the third and fourth of this series, the discussion turns movingly to the doctor's dilemma--and society's--at the junction of life and death. WFB: "Isn't medicine walking into a situation in which it will almost certainly devise terribly expensive technological forms of relief, in which case there is a rationing aspect built into the situation?" WH: "I think one of our difficulties is, in point of fact, that era is already here." ... CL: "Most people in their later years approach the issue of death with one eye on what it will mean for the finances of the family, especially the younger generation." ... MH: "I think it's very clear looking historically that the medical establishment was very reluctant to honor patient requests to not resuscitate or to withdraw feeding tubes, and it took the courts to force the medical establishment to comply with patient wishes. And I think that that has led an attitudinal shift. In fact, the complaint now is that the pendulum has swung too far in the other direction, that now physicians and hospitals are insisting on withdrawing treatment because it's futile under their definition of futility even though the family wants to continue treatment."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1261
Program Number S1001, 2330

"Should Physicians Help Those Who Want to Die?"

Guests: Nuland, Sherwin B. : Reifler, Burton. : Hall, Mark.

27 January 1994

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 9
Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 11
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 3
Program details: All three guests, and their host, know the dangers of legalized euthanasia; as Mr. Buckley puts it, "There are old people in the Netherlands who live in fear and dread that that night somebody is going to stick a needle in them because they are sort of in the way." And yet here is Dr. Nuland, who is no Kevorkian or Derek Humphry: "Until about ten years ago, one could literally ask a nurse for an overdose of morphine or whatever it may be and walk to a patient's bedside and put it into an intravenous solution and sit by the patient's bed until the eventual ending had occurred. [Now] everybody has become so conscious of suits--most particularly, interestingly, the nurses. So you can't do that any more.... So we are, in a sense, phasing out something which understandably we've been doing for a long, long time."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1262
Program Number S1002, 2331

"Welfare: Good or Bad? Part I"

Guests: Murray, Charles A. : Woodson, Robert L. : Greenstein, Robert, 1946- : Rangel, Charles B. : Piven, Frances Fox. : Kinsley, Michael E.

15 March 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 12
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 4
Program details: The first of these lively, not to say rumbustious, follow-up shows focuses on welfare and unemployment, the second on welfare and illegitimacy. One sample: FFP: "Yes, but the implication is that Americans should work at the kinds of jobs that immigrants, nondocumented and otherwise, are taking in our society.... Are we saying that we think that immigrants or non-immigrants ... should work eighty hours a week, two dollars an hour without benefits?" WFB: "No, what I am saying--" FFP: "Why look at one part of the equation? You want to say, Well, if welfare is available, people won't work. They won't work what-- Won't work for wages lower than welfare, which is lower than $370 a month for a family on welfare?" RW: "That's not the total package." WFB: "Look, the Swedes have to import Turks now to do the assembly line. In Detroit they have been using blacks. It's predicted that a generation from now the blacks will say, 'No, we want Hispanics. It's too tedious a job.' ... But there is no real market test as long as you have the welfare alternative .. ." CR: "Just let me ask this: In Mexico, the Mexicans are saying no the Mexican government. They call it a revolution. And there is no welfare. They are just saying they are sick and tired of being enslaved by a society that doesn't give them a reasonable wage to live by."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1264
Program Number S1003, 2332

"Welfare: Good or Bad? Part II"

Guests: Murray, Charles A. : Woodson, Robert L. : Greenstein, Robert, 1946- : Rangel, Charles B : Piven, Frances Fox. : Kinsley, Michael E.

15 March 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 12
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 4
Program details: The first of these lively, not to say rumbustious, follow-up shows focuses on welfare and unemployment, the second on welfare and illegitimacy. One sample: FFP: "Yes, but the implication is that Americans should work at the kinds of jobs that immigrants, nondocumented and otherwise, are taking in our society.... Are we saying that we think that immigrants or non-immigrants ... should work eighty hours a week, two dollars an hour without benefits?" WFB: "No, what I am saying--" FFP: "Why look at one part of the equation? You want to say, Well, if welfare is available, people won't work. They won't work what-- Won't work for wages lower than welfare, which is lower than $370 a month for a family on welfare?" RW: "That's not the total package." WFB: "Look, the Swedes have to import Turks now to do the assembly line. In Detroit they have been using blacks. It's predicted that a generation from now the blacks will say, 'No, we want Hispanics. It's too tedious a job.' ... But there is no real market test as long as you have the welfare alternative .. ." CR: "Just let me ask this: In Mexico, the Mexicans are saying no the Mexican government. They call it a revolution. And there is no welfare. They are just saying they are sick and tired of being enslaved by a society that doesn't give them a reasonable wage to live by."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1265
Program Number S1004, 2333

"Ruminations with Murray Kempton"

Guests: Kempton, Murray, 1917-

28 March 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 13
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 4
Program details: The title is apt: this is not a show with a specific agenda, and even though Messrs. Kempton and Buckley disagree on public policy probably 70 per cent of the time, there are no fireworks between these two old friends--just half an hour's worth of delicious conversation. MK: "Since you've had this program you know many more people than you did before you started it. You've had a parade of felons that would make the average criminal-court judge feel that his calendar was overburdened. But you know them all. I mean, you make a distinction between G. Gordon Liddy and Huey P. Newton... You recognize honor in some people, Bill, and you recognize its absence in others. There are very few people who have honor." "The great aim of life is to have as few apologies to make as humanly possible." "The only terror I felt during [the McCarthy era] was from liberals who used to yell at me for being seen in public talking to Roy Cohn."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1266
Program Number S1005, 2334

"China Trade: The Moral Responsibility of American Business: Part I"

Guests: Baker, Howard. : McGregor, James. : Dicker, Richard. : Solarz, Stephen J. : Regan, Edward V. : Stern, Paula.

25 April 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 14
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 5
Program details: The debate over renewing Most Favored Nation trading status for Communist China was heating up again, and Peking had failed several of the human-rights tests President Clinton had imposed the previous year. All the participants in this first-rate quartet of shows agree that human rights, and America's national interests, must be given great weight. Where they differ is over what means will best serve the end. JM: "If I were a totalitarian regime, the last thing I would want is a whole bunch of Americans in my country running around dealing with my citizens on a one-to-one basis and doing business there, because that is going to erode my power." ... RD: "Frankly, 1993 was the worst year since the immediate aftermath of the Tiananmen Square crackdown in terms of political arrests and political trials in the country. The economic changes that have taken place in China--dramatic, important, and valuable as they are--have not led to any relaxation of political control on basic rights of association, expression, assembly."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1272
Program Number S1006, 2335

"China Trade: The Moral Responsibility of American Business: Part II"

Guests: Baker, Howard. : McGregor, James. : Dicker, Richard. : Solarz, Stephen J. : Regan, Edward V. : Stern, Paula.

25 April 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 14
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 5
Program details: The debate over renewing Most Favored Nation trading status for Communist China was heating up again, and Peking had failed several of the human-rights tests President Clinton had imposed the previous year. All the participants in this first-rate quartet of shows agree that human rights, and America's national interests, must be given great weight. Where they differ is over what means will best serve the end. JM: "If I were a totalitarian regime, the last thing I would want is a whole bunch of Americans in my country running around dealing with my citizens on a one-to-one basis and doing business there, because that is going to erode my power." ... RD: "Frankly, 1993 was the worst year since the immediate aftermath of the Tiananmen Square crackdown in terms of political arrests and political trials in the country. The economic changes that have taken place in China--dramatic, important, and valuable as they are--have not led to any relaxation of political control on basic rights of association, expression, assembly."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1269
Program Number S1007, 2336

"China Trade: Doing Business with China: Part I"

Guests: Solarz, Stephen J. : Pelosi, Nancy. : Fiedler, Jeff. : Jendrzejczyk, Mike. : Regan, Edward V. : Baker, Howard.

25 April 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 15
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 5
Program details: This second pair of shows on China focuses more specifically on the meaning of MFN status. There is less agreement than on the previous show, but plenty of light is generated along with the heat. HB: "[MFN] is a misnomer, really. Most-favored nation to me, in the ordinary parlance of the English language, would suggest that you're giving a very special advantage to a very select group of people. But the fact of the matter is ... MFN has been given to at least a hundred nations now." ... NP: "I do think the worst course of action for the President would be to try to pin a rose on some meager, feeble attempt at improving human rights and try to call that overall significant progress." ... IF: "More outrageous than just simply the [People's Liberation Army] trading into the United States,... the People's Armed Police is in Southfield, Michigan, selling the American people AK-47s." ... SS: "If MFN is removed,... First, we will have shot American consumers in the foot... We will have prejudiced China's cooperation on a host of vitally important strategic issues, including the proliferation of nuclear weapons on the Korean peninsula. We will have debilitated the economy of Hong Kong, and... we will set back the cause of human rights by undermining the viability of the coastal provinces in China."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1270
Program Number S1008, 2337

"China Trade: Doing Business with China: Part II"

Guests: Solarz, Stephen J. : Pelosi, Nancy. : Fiedler, Jeff. : Jendrzejczyk, Mike. : Regan, Edward V. : Baker, Howard.

25 April 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 15
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 5
Program details: This second pair of shows on China focuses more specifically on the meaning of MFN status. There is less agreement than on the previous show, but plenty of light is generated along with the heat. HB: "[MFN] is a misnomer, really. Most-favored nation to me, in the ordinary parlance of the English language, would suggest that you're giving a very special advantage to a very select group of people. But the fact of the matter is ... MFN has been given to at least a hundred nations now." ... NP: "I do think the worst course of action for the President would be to try to pin a rose on some meager, feeble attempt at improving human rights and try to call that overall significant progress." ... IF: "More outrageous than just simply the [People's Liberation Army] trading into the United States,... the People's Armed Police is in Southfield, Michigan, selling the American people AK-47s." ... SS: "If MFN is removed,... First, we will have shot American consumers in the foot... We will have prejudiced China's cooperation on a host of vitally important strategic issues, including the proliferation of nuclear weapons on the Korean peninsula. We will have debilitated the economy of Hong Kong, and... we will set back the cause of human rights by undermining the viability of the coastal provinces in China."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1271
Program Number S1009, 2338

"The Clinton Mess"

Guests: Alexander, Shana. : Green, Mark J.

16 May 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 16
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 6
Program details: Paula Jones had just filed suit against President Clinton, and WFB reminds us of the irony that Mrs. Clinton, during the 1992 campaign, had urged women to emulate Anita Hill and not let men get away with sexual harassment. WFB: "A lot of people slept around with JFK and a lot of them kept quiet about it during the summer of 1960, and I think that was probably the right thing to do." SA: "I'm not sure those two examples are comparable." WFB: "It has to do with character. He was committing adultery. If it had been exposed and put on 60 Minutes that he had done so, it almost certainly would have affected the elections." SA: "Oh, certainly. It would have affected the Clinton election as well if Paula Jones had in a timely fashion brought her charges." ... MG: "He's an extraordinary President, I think. You know, a lot of people, Bill, under this pressure would get vindictive and angry. I saw Richard Nixon do it.... I am impressed with the President's character, showing resilience and dedication and focus, notwithstanding this pressure." WFB: "Well, that's because your perspective leans you in that direction. Other people might say it's a sign of insouciance."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1275
Program Number S1010, 2339

"Looking Back on Reaganomics"

Guests: Kudlow, Lawrence. : Rubenstein, Edwin S. : Bandow, Doug.

28 March 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 17
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 6
Program details: Firing Line has a history of finding guests who can discuss economics in plain English, and this installment is no exception. The question before the house: "Is President Clinton right in claiming credit for the current recovery?" Or is he simply collecting the legacy of Reaganomics? Mostly the latter, say our guests. Mr. Rubenstein explains how lowering the top tax rate brought money out of shelters into productive use; Mr. Kudlow explains the importance of the huge increase in real net worth among all income categories. But the Reagan years weren't perfect: as Mr. Kudlow points out, "the 1986 so-called Deficit Reduction Act was the source of the stalled economy during the Bush years. The other thing I wish the President had erased was signing on to the 1983 Social Security fix ... because this launched another serious of punitive payroll tax increases which has done a lot to hurt middle-class families, it's done a lot to hurt small businesses, and it's been a big discouragement for jobs."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1267
Program Number S1011, 2401

"Money and the Arts"

Guests: Norris, David Owen. : Chapin, Schuyler. : Pocock, David.

28 March 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 18
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 7
Program details: The question before the house is one that has been asked before on Firing Line: "How should the arts be supported?" But this time we approach it in a novel way--through an account of the Irving S. Gilmore Piano Competition, ingeniously devised by Mr. Pocock in fulfilling the terms of Mr. Gilmore's will. A delightful and quite out-of-the-ordinary conversation about a topic host and guests all love. One sample, from Mr. Morris: "Music is not necessarily--I am going to choose my words carefully in a way that I hope you will appreciate--it's not so much a competitive art as an emulatory art. And I like to think that in music we ... are spurred on to our best efforts by the best efforts of our colleagues, and therefore, competition, naked competition [as in the Cliburnor Tchaikovsky competitions] is to some extent anti-musical, because it causes you to concentrate only on those elements of music which make a naked appeal to the guts of the audience, and there is a lot more to music than that, as of course you know."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1268
Program Number S1012, 2402

"Monty: The Legendary World War II General"

Guests: Home, Alistair. : Hamilton, Nigel.

16 May 1994

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 11
Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 19
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 7
Program details: A richly textured discussion of the Normandy landing on the eve of its 50th anniversary. One sample: WFB: "I should like to begin by asking Mr. Home, assuming such an operation as Overlord were undertaken today, would modern cultural circumstances rule it out?" AH: "I think they would have made it extremely unlikely, extremely improbable. Just take a remark made by General Bradley at midday on the 6th of June--this was after the invasion had been going for less than 12 hours--and he said, 'I think we have an irreversible disaster on our hands,' given the appalling carnage on Omaha Beach. ... I think today you would have had CNN on the beaches, and I doubt if it would have been acceptable to have had a D-Day plus 2. Now ... I met Norman Schwarzkopf and I asked him after [the Gulf War] what his biggest problem was, and he said it was quite simply the media ..." NH: "Monty was a great optimist and he believed that it was his task as a great military leader--which is how he saw himself--to inspire the people around him. So he would never allow his mask to drop. I think it's true to say that if Monty had not been appointed to command the American and British and Canadian armies at D-Day, D-Day would have failed."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1273
Program Number S1013, 2403

"Spies and Fellow Travelers"

Guests: Conquest, Robert. : Koch, Stephen.

16 May 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 20
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 8
Program details: Mr. Conquest had taken a great deal of abuse for his "slanders" against the Soviet Union; Mr. Koch, coming after the Cold War, had had a somewhat easier ride. But they both get a chance, in this high-energy discussion, to explore the way the Soviet Union ran its propaganda operation in the West and the reasons people fell for it. WFB: "One critic of your [Mr. Koch's] book said that what made your book essentially incredible is that, after all, one need only ask the question: Given how manifest was the terror and the horror in the Soviet Union, obviously nobody would side with it if they had access to the truth. You answer that how?" SK: "... of course the horrors of the regime were leaking out, seeping out in one way or another. At this point the apparatus would come forward and make an argument that would run roughly as follows: The Soviet Union stands for certain crucial things; for one thing it was anti-fascist. It stands against Hitler. You are making a choice, and the choice must be between Hitler and Stalin...." RC: "Well, I think the atmosphere was very much in all those circles--and it's difficult to think of it now--the enormous euphoria about the Soviet Union ... Although, as you say, the facts were around, they were not believed."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1274
Program Number S1014, 2404

"The Death Penalty: Part I"

Guests: Koch, Ed, 1924- : Boleyn, Susan. : Berns, Walter, 1919- : Glasser, Ira. : Botstein, Leon. : Bright, Stephen B., 1948- : Stevenson, Bryan.

24 May 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 21
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 8
Program details: This pair of shows reaches the shouting stage more than once. But as much as this topic has been discussed over the years, we do learn some new things about it, as well as about the perspectives of people who specialize in it. EK: "Why do you think that the Lindbergh law is so effective? After the Lindbergh federal law--which said that if you kidnapped someone and they were not returned alive, you were subject to the death penalty, whereas if they were returned alive, you might be subject to life imprisonment--kidnappings overwhelmingly across this country ended. There were very few, whereas there were enormous numbers before that law...." IG: "Well, that may have something to do with the fact that the nature of homicides is very different. Kidnapping is a calculated crime; homicide is not, as you well know." ... LB: "Ultimately, age and longevity give people an opportunity for redemption.... The reason to not kill someone--life imprisonment--is, even though they never get out, there is some possibility in life for redemption."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1277
Program Number S1015, 2405

"The Death Penalty: Part II"

Guests: Koch, Ed, 1924- : Boleyn, Susan. : Glasser, Ira. : Botstein, Leon. : Bright, Stephen B., 1948-

24 May 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 21
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 8
Program details: This pair of shows reaches the shouting stage more than once. But as much as this topic has been discussed over the years, we do learn some new things about it, as well as about the perspectives of people who specialize in it. EK: "Why do you think that the Lindbergh law is so effective? After the Lindbergh federal law--which said that if you kidnapped someone and they were not returned alive, you were subject to the death penalty, whereas if they were returned alive, you might be subject to life imprisonment--kidnappings overwhelmingly across this country ended. There were very few, whereas there were enormous numbers before that law...." IG: "Well, that may have something to do with the fact that the nature of homicides is very different. Kidnapping is a calculated crime; homicide is not, as you well know." ... LB: "Ultimately, age and longevity give people an opportunity for redemption.... The reason to not kill someone--life imprisonment--is, even though they never get out, there is some possibility in life for redemption."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1278
Program Number S1016, 2406

"Where Is the GOP Going? Part I: Health Care"

Guests: Rusher, William A., 1923- : Keyes, Alan L. (Alan Lee), 1950- : Noonan, Peggy, 1950- : Frum, David, 1960- : Brookhiser, Richard. : Rollins, Ed.

8 August 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 22
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 9
Program details: It was two months before congressional Democrats would drop the Clinton-inspired effort at a comprehensive reordering of America's health care, and three months before the stunning Gingrich/Contract with America Republican election victory, and "this seminar by conservative Republicans," as Mr. Buckley describes it, ranges from first principles to the latest legislative battle. RB: "I live in New York City. I live in the headquarters of liberalism. I think the Clinton bill should be named the New York City Liberal Democratic Doctor's Conversion Act." ... AK: "There is only one issue on the table, only one issue that I think goes to everything in our politics, and that issue is the erosion and moral collapse of this country. The moral character of this people is in some areas dead, in other areas dying, and if we don't recover it, the whole system, economically and politically, will collapse." ... WAR: "This may be heresy in a group as conservative as this ... I think we'd better give up the idea that we're going to shrink government back to something that would have looked good in 1890. Gang, we are not going to shrink government. There are a quarter of a billion people in the United States of America; they have a lot of different wishes and desires and impulses and needs. And government is going to be in the picture more than you or I would want it to be." ... ER: "Republicans want to do everything the Democrats do for 80 per cent of the cost, and that's a system that will not work."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1279
Program Number S1017, 2407

"Where Is the GOP Going? Part II: Abortion"

Guests: Rusher, William A., 1923- : Keyes, Alan L. (Alan Lee), 1950- : Noonan, Peggy, 1950- : Frum, David, 1960- : Brookhiser, Richard. : Rollins, Ed.

8 August 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 22
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 9
Program details: It was two months before congressional Democrats would drop the Clinton-inspired effort at a comprehensive reordering of America's health care, and three months before the stunning Gingrich/Contract with America Republican election victory, and "this seminar by conservative Republicans," as Mr. Buckley describes it, ranges from first principles to the latest legislative battle. RB: "I live in New York City. I live in the headquarters of liberalism. I think the Clinton bill should be named the New York City Liberal Democratic Doctor's Conversion Act." ... AK: "There is only one issue on the table, only one issue that I think goes to everything in our politics, and that issue is the erosion and moral collapse of this country. The moral character of this people is in some areas dead, in other areas dying, and if we don't recover it, the whole system, economically and politically, will collapse." ... WAR: "This may be heresy in a group as conservative as this ... I think we'd better give up the idea that we're going to shrink government back to something that would have looked good in 1890. Gang, we are not going to shrink government. There are a quarter of a billion people in the United States of America; they have a lot of different wishes and desires and impulses and needs. And government is going to be in the picture more than you or I would want it to be." ... ER: "Republicans want to do everything the Democrats do for 80 per cent of the cost, and that's a system that will not work."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1280
Program Number S1018, 2408

"Where Is the GOP Going? Part III: Big Government"

Guests: Rusher, William A., 1923- : Keyes, Alan L. (Alan Lee), 1950- : Noonan, Peggy, 1950- : Frum, David, 1960- : Brookhiser, Richard. : Rollins, Ed.

8 August 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 22
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 10
Program details: It was two months before congressional Democrats would drop the Clinton-inspired effort at a comprehensive reordering of America's health care, and three months before the stunning Gingrich/Contract with America Republican election victory, and "this seminar by conservative Republicans," as Mr. Buckley describes it, ranges from first principles to the latest legislative battle. RB: "I live in New York City. I live in the headquarters of liberalism. I think the Clinton bill should be named the New York City Liberal Democratic Doctor's Conversion Act." ... AK: "There is only one issue on the table, only one issue that I think goes to everything in our politics, and that issue is the erosion and moral collapse of this country. The moral character of this people is in some areas dead, in other areas dying, and if we don't recover it, the whole system, economically and politically, will collapse." ... WAR: "This may be heresy in a group as conservative as this ... I think we'd better give up the idea that we're going to shrink government back to something that would have looked good in 1890. Gang, we are not going to shrink government. There are a quarter of a billion people in the United States of America; they have a lot of different wishes and desires and impulses and needs. And government is going to be in the picture more than you or I would want it to be." ... ER: "Republicans want to do everything the Democrats do for 80 per cent of the cost, and that's a system that will not work."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1281
Program Number S1019, 2409

"Where Is the GOP Going? Part IV: Questions and Answers from Young Republicans"

Guests: Rusher, William A., 1923- : Keyes, Alan L. (Alan Lee), 1950- : Noonan, Peggy, 1950- : Frum, David, 1960- : Brookhiser, Richard. : Rollins, Ed.

8 August 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 137 : 22
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 10
Program details: It was two months before congressional Democrats would drop the Clinton-inspired effort at a comprehensive reordering of America's health care, and three months before the stunning Gingrich/Contract with America Republican election victory, and "this seminar by conservative Republicans," as Mr. Buckley describes it, ranges from first principles to the latest legislative battle. RB: "I live in New York City. I live in the headquarters of liberalism. I think the Clinton bill should be named the New York City Liberal Democratic Doctor's Conversion Act." ... AK: "There is only one issue on the table, only one issue that I think goes to everything in our politics, and that issue is the erosion and moral collapse of this country. The moral character of this people is in some areas dead, in other areas dying, and if we don't recover it, the whole system, economically and politically, will collapse." ... WAR: "This may be heresy in a group as conservative as this ... I think we'd better give up the idea that we're going to shrink government back to something that would have looked good in 1890. Gang, we are not going to shrink government. There are a quarter of a billion people in the United States of America; they have a lot of different wishes and desires and impulses and needs. And government is going to be in the picture more than you or I would want it to be." ... ER: "Republicans want to do everything the Democrats do for 80 per cent of the cost, and that's a system that will not work."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1282
Program Number S1020, 2410

"Separation of Church and State: Part I: The Constitutional Aspect"

Guests: Graglia, Lino A. : Neuhaus, Richard John. : Paulsen, Michael. : Dershowitz, Alan M. : Lynn, Barry W. : Dorsen, Norman. : Teitel, Ruti G. : Kinsley, Michael E.

8 September 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 11
Program details: A kaleidoscopic pair of shows, as rapid-fire duels alternate with calm--and deeply informative--reflection. ND: "With respect to the church-state issue ... there are two provisions in the First Amendment, and they look in opposite directions ..." WFB: "I think it's complementary. Don't you agree, Father Neuhaus? My chances of practicing my religion increase to the extent that yours decrease of establishing a religion." RJN: "Your point is exactly right, and of course that drives to the heart of an important disagreement. The two provisions of the one religion clause are not, in my judgment, to be balanced one against the other.... The clear purpose of the religion clause ... --and it is grammatically one clause and in purpose one clause--is to protect religious freedom." ... AD: "If Abraham today had gone out to sacrifice Isaac, I would indict him for attempted murder." LG: "Would you defend him?" AD: "I would defend him." ... WFB: "If I say I believe in incest?" AD: "I would like to try to talk you out of it." WFB: "There're a lot of interesting ways of handling that question, but one that immediately catches my attention is that it's proscribed by the Bible." AD: "And so how do you persuade somebody who doesn't believe in the Bible?" WFB: "The Bible I consider to be the centerpiece from which the moral culture of our society springs." ND: "The Athenians had a highly developed theoretical construct that guided the people. There are other ways of developing values."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1285
Program Number S1021, 2411

"Separation of Church and State: Part II: The Social Aspect"

Guests: Graglia, Lino A. : Neuhaus, Richard John. : Paulsen, Michael. : Dershowitz, Alan M. : Lynn, Barry W. : Dorsen, Norman. : Teitel, Ruti G. : Kinsley, Michael E.

8 September 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 11
Program details: A kaleidoscopic pair of shows, as rapid-fire duels alternate with calm--and deeply informative--reflection. ND: "With respect to the church-state issue ... there are two provisions in the First Amendment, and they look in opposite directions ..." WFB: "I think it's complementary. Don't you agree, Father Neuhaus? My chances of practicing my religion increase to the extent that yours decrease of establishing a religion." RJN: "Your point is exactly right, and of course that drives to the heart of an important disagreement. The two provisions of the one religion clause are not, in my judgment, to be balanced one against the other.... The clear purpose of the religion clause ... --and it is grammatically one clause and in purpose one clause--is to protect religious freedom." ... AD: "If Abraham today had gone out to sacrifice Isaac, I would indict him for attempted murder." LG: "Would you defend him?" AD: "I would defend him." ... WFB: "If I say I believe in incest?" AD: "I would like to try to talk you out of it." WFB: "There're a lot of interesting ways of handling that question, but one that immediately catches my attention is that it's proscribed by the Bible." AD: "And so how do you persuade somebody who doesn't believe in the Bible?" WFB: "The Bible I consider to be the centerpiece from which the moral culture of our society springs." ND: "The Athenians had a highly developed theoretical construct that guided the people. There are other ways of developing values."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1284
Program Number S1022, 2412

"Perspectives on Health Care: Part I: Managed Care"

Guests: Campbell, Carroll. : Burton, Marion. : Middleton, Francis. : Scott, Richard. : Seward, John. : Timmerman, William.

15 September 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 12
Program details: These shows were taped 11 days before Senate Majority Leader George Mitchell withdrew the Clinton health-care proposal from Senate consideration. But as we know in retrospect, the issue by no means died with the bill. These shows help us to understand why the Clinton bill died, and to evaluate what has happened since. Dr. Seward: "If your basic premise is that my only purpose is to cut costs,... this is the area that I think we have to look at very very closely.... For instance,... just do generic prescribing, period. I'm sorry, from a clinical standpoint as a practicing family physician, there are certain trade name drugs that I think from a true chemical standpoint are the only things to provide.... Whenever you talk about costs, somehow you have to get it back to, How is it going to affect that patient?" ... Gov. Campbell: "There is a school of thought that exists in Washington that comes down from on high from some of the professors at Harvard--with whom I had the privilege to sit for countless hours and listen and learn very little--that they know best what we should do, that they understand more than we do." ... Mr. Scott: "As we know, the government cannot run health care. The average Medicaid recipient gets more than twice as much health care as the average employed person in this country. And they don't like the care, the doctors don't like how they're getting paid, nor does the hospital, and there's no control on quality."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1286
Program Number S1023, 2413

"Perspectives on Health Care: Part II: The Elderly"

Guests: Campbell, Carroll. : Burton, Marion. : Boger, Jack. : Keenan, Joseph. : Seward, John. : McCurdy, Layton.

15 September 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 12
Program details: These shows were taped 11 days before Senate Majority Leader George Mitchell withdrew the Clinton health-care proposal from Senate consideration. But as we know in retrospect, the issue by no means died with the bill. These shows help us to understand why the Clinton bill died, and to evaluate what has happened since. Dr. Seward: "If your basic premise is that my only purpose is to cut costs,... this is the area that I think we have to look at very very closely.... For instance,... just do generic prescribing, period. I'm sorry, from a clinical standpoint as a practicing family physician, there are certain trade name drugs that I think from a true chemical standpoint are the only things to provide.... Whenever you talk about costs, somehow you have to get it back to, How is it going to affect that patient?" ... Gov. Campbell: "There is a school of thought that exists in Washington that comes down from on high from some of the professors at Harvard--with whom I had the privilege to sit for countless hours and listen and learn very little--that they know best what we should do, that they understand more than we do." ... Mr. Scott: "As we know, the government cannot run health care. The average Medicaid recipient gets more than twice as much health care as the average employed person in this country. And they don't like the care, the doctors don't like how they're getting paid, nor does the hospital, and there's no control on quality."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1287
Program Number S1024, 2414

"Perspectives on Health Care: Part III: Hospitals"

Guests: McCurdy, Layton. : Scott, Richard. : Sellers, Edward. : Wilson, Larry. : Seward, John. : Wiles, Paul.

15 September 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 12
Program details: These shows were taped 11 days before Senate Majority Leader George Mitchell withdrew the Clinton health-care proposal from Senate consideration. But as we know in retrospect, the issue by no means died with the bill. These shows help us to understand why the Clinton bill died, and to evaluate what has happened since. Dr. Seward: "If your basic premise is that my only purpose is to cut costs,... this is the area that I think we have to look at very very closely.... For instance,... just do generic prescribing, period. I'm sorry, from a clinical standpoint as a practicing family physician, there are certain trade name drugs that I think from a true chemical standpoint are the only things to provide.... Whenever you talk about costs, somehow you have to get it back to, How is it going to affect that patient?" ... Gov. Campbell: "There is a school of thought that exists in Washington that comes down from on high from some of the professors at Harvard--with whom I had the privilege to sit for countless hours and listen and learn very little--that they know best what we should do, that they understand more than we do." ... Mr. Scott: "As we know, the government cannot run health care. The average Medicaid recipient gets more than twice as much health care as the average employed person in this country. And they don't like the care, the doctors don't like how they're getting paid, nor does the hospital, and there's no control on quality."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1288
Program Number S1025, 2415

"Mini-Series on Crime: Part I: Does Punishment Deter Crime?"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Goodman, John C. : Hightower, Jim. : Sanders, Harold Barefoot, Jr. : Bronstein, Alvin.

4 October 1994

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 12
Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 3
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 13
Program details: On one thing host and guests are all agreed: our current criminal-justice system is broke and needs fixing. But what is cause and what is effect? Is there even such a thing as deterrence? Mr. Bronstein doesn't think so: "We have the most punitive, incarcerative country in the world, ten times as much as most Western European countries, and our crime keeps going up." Mr. Goodman points out a racial discrepancy: "The homicide rate among Caucasians in the United States is lower than it is in England, and on a par with most European countries. What's taking the United States off the map in these international comparisons is the very high crime rate in our minority communities, mainly in inner cities, where the victims as well as the perpetrators are often black." Mr. Hightower seems to agree, although with a twist: "Most auto theft is not about getting a car. Most auto theft is about carjacking, is about crack cocaine, is about none of the rationality that six white guys sitting around this table here know anything about." So why should we keep trying? Because, as Judge Sanders puts it, "I don't know of anyone in this room here who feels safe." A last word from Mr. Bronstein: "If Mr. Buckley ran his sailboat the way we fight crime in this country, he'd be fish food today."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1289
Program Number S1026, 2416

"Mini-Series on Crime: Part II: Is the Solution to Crime More Punishment?"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Goodman, John C. : Hightower, Jim. : Sanders, Harold Barefoot, Jr. : Bronstein, Alvin.

4 October 1994

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 12
Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 3
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 13
Program details: On one thing host and guests are all agreed: our current criminal-justice system is broke and needs fixing. But what is cause and what is effect? Is there even such a thing as deterrence? Mr. Bronstein doesn't think so: "We have the most punitive, incarcerative country in the world, ten times as much as most Western European countries, and our crime keeps going up." Mr. Goodman points out a racial discrepancy: "The homicide rate among Caucasians in the United States is lower than it is in England, and on a par with most European countries. What's taking the United States off the map in these international comparisons is the very high crime rate in our minority communities, mainly in inner cities, where the victims as well as the perpetrators are often black." Mr. Hightower seems to agree, although with a twist: "Most auto theft is not about getting a car. Most auto theft is about carjacking, is about crack cocaine, is about none of the rationality that six white guys sitting around this table here know anything about." So why should we keep trying? Because, as Judge Sanders puts it, "I don't know of anyone in this room here who feels safe." A last word from Mr. Bronstein: "If Mr. Buckley ran his sailboat the way we fight crime in this country, he'd be fish food today."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1290
Program Number S1027, 2417

"Mini-Series on Crime: Part III: Do We Need Prisons at All?"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S.[Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Goodman, John C. : Colson, Charles W. : Bright, Stephen B., 1948- : Harris, Jean.

4 October 1994

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 12
Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 4
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 14
Program details: The tone changes in this installment, with the addition of two guests who know prisons from the inside. Mr. Colson, in particular, has thought long and hard about what we might do differently: "You can punish someone very severely, white collar or blue collar, without necessarily putting him in prison. I was in a prison dormitory with twenty guys ... who had done car theft and petty stock swindling--$3,000, this kind of scam. If you put those people cleaning out bedpans in the hospital or doing some public work for three or four years and take away their weekends, that's severe punishment. You don't have to lock them up at a cost of $30,000 a year to the taxpayers." ... Mrs. Harris: "One thing I think you've overlooked completely is that when we're making restitution to victims a very large percentage of people in prison were victims before they got to prison. I don't know what the percentage is, but I know it's over 10 per cent of the women at Bedford [the prison Mrs. Harris was in] who were raped as little children, who have had all sorts of terrible things--they come in with ulcerated sores where they've been stabbed with rusty knives."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1291
Program Number S1028, 2418

"Mini-Series on Crime: Part IV: Realistic Insights into Crime and Punishment"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. : Goodman, John C. : Colson, Charles W. : Bright, Stephen B., 1948- : Harris, Jean.

4 October 1994

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 12
Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 4
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 14
Program details: The tone changes in this installment, with the addition of two guests who know prisons from the inside. Mr. Colson, in particular, has thought long and hard about what we might do differently: "You can punish someone very severely, white collar or blue collar, without necessarily putting him in prison. I was in a prison dormitory with twenty guys ... who had done car theft and petty stock swindling--$3,000, this kind of scam. If you put those people cleaning out bedpans in the hospital or doing some public work for three or four years and take away their weekends, that's severe punishment. You don't have to lock them up at a cost of $30,000 a year to the taxpayers." ... Mrs. Harris: "One thing I think you've overlooked completely is that when we're making restitution to victims a very large percentage of people in prison were victims before they got to prison. I don't know what the percentage is, but I know it's over 10 per cent of the women at Bedford [the prison Mrs. Harris was in] who were raped as little children, who have had all sorts of terrible things--they come in with ulcerated sores where they've been stabbed with rusty knives."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1292
Program Number S1029, 2419

"The Bell Curve of Intelligence"

Guests: Murray, Charles A. : Holt, Jim. : Botstein, Leon.

29 November 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 5
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 15
Program details: Richard Herrnstein (who had died of cancer just before The Bell Curve was published) and Charles Murray had expected their book to stir up controversy; they hadn't been quite prepared for the sheer dishonesty of much of the criticism. That does not apply to today's guests: for starters, although Messrs. Holt and Botstein are both highly critical of the book, they have both clearly read it. One sample: LB: "I came away with a sense that you have no real optimism whatsoever that there is anything that society collectively can do to improve radically the performance of the people at the bottom of the bell-shaped curve." CM: "I won't argue with that." This discussion, like the book itself, has serious implications for our education system, urban society, and indeed the shape of American democracy.
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1293
Program Number S1030, 2420

"The IQ Controversy: What's Going On?"

Guests: Murray, Charles A. : Holt, Jim. : Botstein, Leon.

29 November 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 5
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 15
Program details: Richard Herrnstein (who had died of cancer just before The Bell Curve was published) and Charles Murray had expected their book to stir up controversy; they hadn't been quite prepared for the sheer dishonesty of much of the criticism. That does not apply to today's guests: for starters, although Messrs. Holt and Botstein are both highly critical of the book, they have both clearly read it. One sample: LB: "I came away with a sense that you have no real optimism whatsoever that there is anything that society collectively can do to improve radically the performance of the people at the bottom of the bell-shaped curve." CM: "I won't argue with that." This discussion, like the book itself, has serious implications for our education system, urban society, and indeed the shape of American democracy.
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1294
Program Number S1031, 2421

"The Women's Movement: Part I"

Guests: Fox-Genovese, Elizabeth, 1941- : Huffington, Arianna Stassinopoulos, 1950- : Alvare, Helen. : Friedan, Betty. : Burstein, Karen S. : Paglia, Camille, 1947- : Kolbert, Kathryn.

7 December 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 8
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 16
Program details: Typically, the free-form discussion following a Firing Line debate is fairly rambunctious. This one is gloriously off the charts. When the shouting subsides enough for sentences to be heard, they are well worth listening to. EFG: "The original women's movement has succeeded brilliantly. It is frequently said that the 1980s were a backlash against women, yet during the 1980s women went from earning 63 cents on the male dollar to earning 95 or more cents on the male dollar for entry-level positions. No social group in history has revolutionized their status in comparable fashion." ... ASH: "Please wake up, Betty! Something very fundamental is happening and you don't have a clue. There is a fundamental revolution happening that is about people recognizing that in the last thirty years we have spent $5 trillion on welfare and every single indicator is worse than it was." ... KK: "The original question of this show is: Has the women's movement gone too far? And I think the answer is, We haven't gone far enough. There is real injustice continuing to exist in this nation as a result of gender discrimination."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1297
Program Number S1032, 2422

"The Women's Movement: Part II"

Guests: Fox-Genovese, Elizabeth, 1941- : Huffington, Arianna Stassinopoulos, 1950- : Alvare, Helen. : Friedan, Betty. : Burstein, Karen S. : Paglia, Camille, 1947- : Kolbert, Kathryn.

7 December 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 8
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 16
Program details: Typically, the free-form discussion following a Firing Line debate is fairly rambunctious. This one is gloriously off the charts. When the shouting subsides enough for sentences to be heard, they are well worth listening to. EFG: "The original women's movement has succeeded brilliantly. It is frequently said that the 1980s were a backlash against women, yet during the 1980s women went from earning 63 cents on the male dollar to earning 95 or more cents on the male dollar for entry-level positions. No social group in history has revolutionized their status in comparable fashion." ... ASH: "Please wake up, Betty! Something very fundamental is happening and you don't have a clue. There is a fundamental revolution happening that is about people recognizing that in the last thirty years we have spent $5 trillion on welfare and every single indicator is worse than it was." ... KK: "The original question of this show is: Has the women's movement gone too far? And I think the answer is, We haven't gone far enough. There is real injustice continuing to exist in this nation as a result of gender discrimination."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1298
Program Number S1033, 2423

"What Now for Russia?"

Guests: Remnick, David.

29 November 1994

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 9
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 17
Program details: A gloomy but informative discussion of the shape post-Soviet society has taken and may be expected to take in the future. DR: "My feeling about Reagan is that he played an incredible, somewhat instinctual role, a somewhat political and very hard-headed role in the collapse of the Soviet Union." ... "There is a lot of disenchantment among the people who were in the forefront in the late Eighties or early Nineties. People who ... saw Dostoyevsky scholars liberating Russia from its enslavement, all of a sudden found themselves poor and ignored and irrelevant.... What was needed in society were not saints, scholars, and truth-tellers, but accountants, traders, whatever is needed to build a capitalist nation."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1295
Program Number S1034, 2424

"Higher Interest Rates: Good or Bad? Part I"

Guests: Levy, David A. : Kemp, Jack. : Martin, Preston. : Rubenstein, Edwin S. : Kuttner, Robert.

11 January 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 13
Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 17
Program details: WFB warns us at the outset: "The ambitious purpose of this and the succeeding hour is to ponder the Federal Reserve Board's apparent attitude towards interest rates, and also to introduce the uninitiated--which includes your moderator--to the arcana of interest-rate practices and to the rather special vocabulary used in discussing the question. Keep your eyes on me. As long as I continue to sit here, you can stick around. If you see me slide away, you are at liberty to turn to another channel." In fact, although the discussion of interest rates, inflation, taxes, and more is often highly technical, Mr. Buckley sticks around, and so should we. One sample from Mr. Martin: "People in Washington do not know what is going on in the real world.... The mistake the central bank makes as it evolves is making governors out of staff people who have worked at the Fed for 39 years and 4 months and never really listened to the bank presidents of the 12 Fed banks when they tell you what's going on in New York and New Jersey and how sick that submarket really is."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1299
Program Number S1035, 2425

"Higher Interest Rates: Good or Bad? Part II"

Guests: Levy, David A. : Kemp, Jack. : Martin, Preston. : Rubenstein, Edwin S. : Kuttner, Robert.

11 January 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 13
Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 17
Program details: WFB warns us at the outset: "The ambitious purpose of this and the succeeding hour is to ponder the Federal Reserve Board's apparent attitude towards interest rates, and also to introduce the uninitiated--which includes your moderator--to the arcana of interest-rate practices and to the rather special vocabulary used in discussing the question. Keep your eyes on me. As long as I continue to sit here, you can stick around. If you see me slide away, you are at liberty to turn to another channel." In fact, although the discussion of interest rates, inflation, taxes, and more is often highly technical, Mr. Buckley sticks around, and so should we. One sample from Mr. Martin: "People in Washington do not know what is going on in the real world.... The mistake the central bank makes as it evolves is making governors out of staff people who have worked at the Fed for 39 years and 4 months and never really listened to the bank presidents of the 12 Fed banks when they tell you what's going on in New York and New Jersey and how sick that submarket really is."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1300
Program Number S1036, 2426

"How Tax Cuts Look for '95: Part I"

Guests: Levy, David A. : Kemp, Jack. : Regan, Edward V. : Kuttner, Robert.

11 January 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 14
Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 11
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 18
Program details: The Republicans, led by Newt Gingrich, had just taken control of the House of Representatives for the first time in forty years, and tax cuts were a big part of their "Contract with America." But they were far from the only tax-cutters: President Clinton, House Majority Leader turned Minority Leader Richard Gephardt, Senator Phil Gramm--all God's chillun had tax-cut plans. This show, no less technical than its predecessor, brilliantly clarifies the points at issue: across-the-board versus targeted cuts; the capital-gains tax; spending and the Balanced Budget Amendment. RK: "As that well-known Bolshevik Herb Stein, Nixon's former chief economist, wrote in this week's New Republic, you could have a deficit of 2.5 per cent of the gross domestic product forever, and as along as the economy was growing faster than the deficit, it wouldn't be a problem. So I think this balanced-budget mania is absolutely counterproductive."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1301
Program Number S1037, 2427

"How Tax Cuts Look for '95: Part II"

Guests: Levy, David A. : Kemp, Jack. : Regan, Edward V. : Kuttner, Robert.

11 January 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 98 : 14
Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 11
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 18
Program details: The Republicans, led by Newt Gingrich, had just taken control of the House of Representatives for the first time in forty years, and tax cuts were a big part of their "Contract with America." But they were far from the only tax-cutters: President Clinton, House Majority Leader turned Minority Leader Richard Gephardt, Senator Phil Gramm--all God's chillun had tax-cut plans. This show, no less technical than its predecessor, brilliantly clarifies the points at issue: across-the-board versus targeted cuts; the capital-gains tax; spending and the Balanced Budget Amendment. RK: "As that well-known Bolshevik Herb Stein, Nixon's former chief economist, wrote in this week's New Republic, you could have a deficit of 2.5 per cent of the gross domestic product forever, and as along as the economy was growing faster than the deficit, it wouldn't be a problem. So I think this balanced-budget mania is absolutely counterproductive."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1302
Program Number S1038, 2428

"Is New York City Governable?"

Guests: Giuliani, Rudolph W.

23 January 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 1
Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 12
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 19
Program details: His Honor answers the title question with a resounding "Yes!" He backs up his enthusiasm with persuasive details, on matters ranging from pornography to illegal immigration to taxes to homelessness, and argues his case for engaging the not-for-profit private sector instead of having the city government try to do everything itself. One sample: RG: "Had I been elected five years ago [without the intervening administration of David Dinkins, who defeated Mayor Koch], I could not have done the things that I was able to do four years later. Unfortunately the shattering of the private sector and some of the heavy increases in crime made possible the things that we were able to do."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1303
Program Number S1039, 2429

"Testing the American Dream at City College"

Guests: Traub, James. : Glazer, Nathan.

23 January 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 2
Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 19
Program details: The City College of New York was alma mater to a galaxy of American luminaries, including Sidney Hook, Ed Koch, and our guest Nathan Glazer--the sons of poor families, often Jewish immigrants, who could not, in the 1930s and '40s, gain admittance to Harvard, Yale, or Columbia. In 1969, however, in response to pressure from student militants, the college instituted "open enrollment" (see Firing Lines s0277 and s01171). As Mr. Traub puts it, "It was not only a laudable motive in some ways, it was almost unavoidable ... But the fact is, once that was done, nobody could really admit that the consequences were going to be disastrous for City's own standards." A moving examination of a local tragedy.
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1304
Program Number S1040, 2430

"How Should Abortion Protestors Behave?"

Guests: Neuhaus, Richard John. : Stover, Dawn Marie.

23 January 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 3
Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 7
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 20
Program details: Twice in recent months, in Pensacola, Fla., and in Brookline, Mass., abortionists and support staff had been slain by extreme anti-abortion activists. Pro-choicers had swung into action on this target of opportunity, and pro-lifers were, mostly, trying to limit the damage. Mrs. Stover comes perilously close to justifying the killings, but Father Neuhaus firmly brings the discussion back to orthodox moral theology: "What the Paul Hills have done is that they have confirmed precisely the logic of the Roe v. Wade decision, and that is that lethal violence can be a matter of private preference or of private conviction. No society can do that."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1305
Program Number S1041, 2431

"Are Jury Awards Too High?"

Guests: Huber, Peter W. (Peter William), 1952- : Horowitz, Michael J., 1938- : Weisl, Edwin, Jr. : Dershowitz, Alan M. : Pegalis, Steven E. : Moore, Thomas A. : Gilbert, Pamela.

2 March 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 13
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 20
Program details: It might have been easier for Mr. Buckley to maintain order if he had had the power to sentence his guests for contempt; but when they stop shouting, they give us plenty to think about. Samples: MH: "As somebody who's fought hard for reform, I think loser-pays, in its current form, stinks. It's the sort of thing that allows the proponents of the status quo to play caricaturing games and sink the whole ship and pose as consumer champions...." TM: "The basic premise is fallacious, because the basic premise is ... you lose, therefore there was no merit. And that's not our legal system; it never was our legal system. We all know that meritorious cases can be lost and meritorious defenses can at times not prevail." ... EW: "I don't think there is a lawyer alive who is worth $500 an hour." AD: "Now you're hitting home." EW: "I know. I used to get that, and I thought it was ridiculous."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1307
Program Number S1042, 2432

"Too Many Lawyers, Too Many Lawsuits?"

Guests: Huber, Peter W. (Peter William), 1952- : Horowitz, Michael J., 1938- : Weisl, Edwin, Jr. : Dershowitz, Alan M. : Pegalis, Steven E. : Moore, Thomas A. : Gilbert, Pamela.

2 March 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 138 : 13
Transcript: Box/Folder 186 : 20
Program details: It might have been easier for Mr. Buckley to maintain order if he had had the power to sentence his guests for contempt; but when they stop shouting, they give us plenty to think about. Samples: MH: "As somebody who's fought hard for reform, I think loser-pays, in its current form, stinks. It's the sort of thing that allows the proponents of the status quo to play caricaturing games and sink the whole ship and pose as consumer champions...." TM: "The basic premise is fallacious, because the basic premise is ... you lose, therefore there was no merit. And that's not our legal system; it never was our legal system. We all know that meritorious cases can be lost and meritorious defenses can at times not prevail." ... EW: "I don't think there is a lawyer alive who is worth $500 an hour." AD: "Now you're hitting home." EW: "I know. I used to get that, and I thought it was ridiculous."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1308
Program Number S1043, 2433

"Should We Privatize the Welfare State? Part I"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Brown, Jerry, 1938- : Shrum, Robert. : Innis, Roy, 1934- : Daly, Sharon. : Goodman, John C. : Woodson, Robert L. : Blank, Rebecca M.

4 April 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 4
Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 1
Program details: "The welfare-reform proposals sitting before Congress are so contentious," Mr. Buckley begins, "that everyone known to the Producer of Firing Line has put in to give his views on them." Sometimes--when all eight guests speak at once--we may feel that less would have been more. But we get a fascinating range of views on matters like how long recipients ought to be able to stay on welfare, what is the most productive way of changing the current system, and how welfare and illegitimacy interact. Mr. Goodman: "Half the children in the country are getting a subsidized lunch at school today. We cannot afford to subsidize lunches for half the population. We've got to target the money to people who are poor, and that, quite frankly, is what the Republicans in Congress are trying to do now." Mr. Shrum: "I hope you guys run against school lunches in '96. I look forward to it."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1309
Program Number S1044, 2434

"Should We Privatize the Welfare State? Part II"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Ponte, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Brown, Jerry, 1938- : Shrum, Robert. : Innis, Roy, 1934- : Daly, Sharon. : Goodman, John C. : Woodson, Robert L. : Blank, Rebecca M.

4 April 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 4
Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 1
Program details: "The welfare-reform proposals sitting before Congress are so contentious," Mr. Buckley begins, "that everyone known to the Producer of Firing Line has put in to give his views on them." Sometimes--when all eight guests speak at once--we may feel that less would have been more. But we get a fascinating range of views on matters like how long recipients ought to be able to stay on welfare, what is the most productive way of changing the current system, and how welfare and illegitimacy interact. Mr. Goodman: "Half the children in the country are getting a subsidized lunch at school today. We cannot afford to subsidize lunches for half the population. We've got to target the money to people who are poor, and that, quite frankly, is what the Republicans in Congress are trying to do now." Mr. Shrum: "I hope you guys run against school lunches in '96. I look forward to it."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1310
Program Number S1045, 2435

"Should We Privatize Social Security? Part I"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Brown, Jerry, 1938- : Shrum, Robert. : Innis, Roy, 1934- : Goodman, John C.

4 April 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 5
Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 2
Program details: These sessions are a bit calmer than the ones on welfare reform, and light as well as heat is generated. RI: "We first need to start by declaring that the Social Security program devised in 1935 was a phenomenal success--but a success whose time has passed ... We need to design a new plan now--not a 20th-century plan: design a 21st-century plan from scratch." ... JB: "I would point out that the people who become more disabled and less capable of working are disproportionately poor. Those who have lived a better life, a higher-income life, continue working much longer." ... RS: "If you say to people, 'Look, we're going to get rid of Social Security; it doesn't work. Trust me, I'm from the government. I'm going to build you a new and better retirement system,' you're going to get a very skeptical response." ... PdP: "Twice as many young people believe in UFOs as believe that they are going to get their Social Security benefits when they retire."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1311
Program Number S1046, 2436

"Should We Privatize Social Security? Part II"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Brown, Jerry, 1938- : Shrum, Robert. : Innis, Roy, 1934- : Goodman, John C.

4 April 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 5
Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 2
Program details: These sessions are a bit calmer than the ones on welfare reform, and light as well as heat is generated. RI: "We first need to start by declaring that the Social Security program devised in 1935 was a phenomenal success--but a success whose time has passed ... We need to design a new plan now--not a 20th-century plan: design a 21st-century plan from scratch." ... JB: "I would point out that the people who become more disabled and less capable of working are disproportionately poor. Those who have lived a better life, a higher-income life, continue working much longer." ... RS: "If you say to people, 'Look, we're going to get rid of Social Security; it doesn't work. Trust me, I'm from the government. I'm going to build you a new and better retirement system,' you're going to get a very skeptical response." ... PdP: "Twice as many young people believe in UFOs as believe that they are going to get their Social Security benefits when they retire."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1314
Program Number S1047, 2437

"The China Dilemma: The United Nations"

Guests: Hu, Jason Chih-chiang. : Kissinger, Henry, 1923-

30 May 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 3
Program details: Twenty-two years after its expulsion from the United Nations, the Republic of China (AKA Nationalist China, AKA Taiwan) was seeking re-entry. This discussion is often cautious--since Mr. Hu is officially representing his government, and Dr. Kissinger, although currently without portfolio, carries a great deal of diplomatic baggage. But we get fascinating shifts in perspective, as we see the issue first through the eyes of a man whose country has been relegated to "second-class" status, and then through those of a man who sees Taiwan/Mainland China as only one part of a picture that includes "problems with Japan,... unsettled conditions in Russia and other parts of Asia." As WFB puts it, "It doesn't have the stuff of causes militant, does it? This is to say, people aren't going to say: 'Well, there was the civil rights in the South, there was getting out of Vietnam, now there's getting Taiwan into the United Nations.' It's not a mobilizing pressure."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1315
Program Number S1048, 2438

"The China Dilemma: Relations across the Taiwan Straits"

Guests: Hu, Jason Chih-chiang. : Kissinger, Henry, 1923-

30 May 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 3
Program details: Twenty-two years after its expulsion from the United Nations, the Republic of China (AKA Nationalist China, AKA Taiwan) was seeking re-entry. This discussion is often cautious--since Mr. Hu is officially representing his government, and Dr. Kissinger, although currently without portfolio, carries a great deal of diplomatic baggage. But we get fascinating shifts in perspective, as we see the issue first through the eyes of a man whose country has been relegated to "second-class" status, and then through those of a man who sees Taiwan/Mainland China as only one part of a picture that includes "problems with Japan,... unsettled conditions in Russia and other parts of Asia." As WFB puts it, "It doesn't have the stuff of causes militant, does it? This is to say, people aren't going to say: 'Well, there was the civil rights in the South, there was getting out of Vietnam, now there's getting Taiwan into the United Nations.' It's not a mobilizing pressure."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1316
Program Number S1049, 2439

"China and the Human Rights Issue"

Guests: Kissinger, Henry, 1923- : Gregg, Donald. : Dicker, Richard. : Hu, Jason Chih-chiang.

30 May 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 4
Program details: The guests are less cautious on this show than the previous one, and the perspectives multiply for an informative and often moving session. RD: "In the last year, since President Clinton decided to unconditionally renew China's Most Favored Nation trade status, the human-rights situation in the country has deteriorated dramatically." ... HK: "... we should recognize that Japan is bound to move in a more national direction--not anti-American, necessarily, but not so unquestionably pro-American as they were. Therefore we should not make issues with them that offend their pride, even if we win, unless we can relate them to some big objective."... JH: "Do we really want to live in a world where we only talk about Realpolitik? ... Maybe in this world today morality is irrelevant in international politics, but can you name a country which is happy and willing to be accused of being immoral? No."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1317
Program Number S1050, 2440

"China, Security, and Human Rights"

Guests: Hu, Jason Chih-chiang. : Kissinger, Henry, 1923- : Gregg, Donald. : Dicker, Richard.

30 May 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 4
Program details: The guests are less cautious on this show than the previous one, and the perspectives multiply for an informative and often moving session. RD: "In the last year, since President Clinton decided to unconditionally renew China's Most Favored Nation trade status, the human-rights situation in the country has deteriorated dramatically." ... HK: "... we should recognize that Japan is bound to move in a more national direction--not anti-American, necessarily, but not so unquestionably pro-American as they were. Therefore we should not make issues with them that offend their pride, even if we win, unless we can relate them to some big objective."... JH: "Do we really want to live in a world where we only talk about Realpolitik? ... Maybe in this world today morality is irrelevant in international politics, but can you name a country which is happy and willing to be accused of being immoral? No."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1318
Program Number S1051, 2501

"Should We Drastically Reduce Immigration? Part I"

Guests: Brimelow, Peter, 1947- : Stein, Daniel. : Huffington, Arianna Stassinopoulos, 1950- : Botstein, Leon. : Koch, Ed, 1924- : Sharry, Frank. : Glasser, Ira.

6 June 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 3
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 5
Program details: Accusations fly, along with contradictory statistics, but beneath the noise we hear the great themes of the debate that Mr. Brimelow called for in the preceding debate. LB: "I think it is scandalous for us to sit here and to ascribe the persistent and terrible condition of the African-American poor in this country to immigrants, when in fact it is the responsibility of the long-term residents of this nation." ... ASH: "It is quite laughable for anybody who's been to California to listen to Mr. Sharry talk about all these invigorating immigrants.... Really, anybody who talks to the underclass that you mentioned in California knows that they feel very resentful, and if we want to avoid the kind of explosion of racism that we should avoid, we need to take care of the problem now." ... EK: "We are a country--and I agree with Peter on this--that is founded in the Judaeo-Christian ethic, in Western European mores, and I deplore those who want to shift us away from that, and it doesn't make any difference whether we come from Asia or Africa or Latin America, there is an American ethos, and the immigrants want to be a part of it."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1319
Program Number S1052, 2502

"Should We Drastically Reduce Immigration? Part II"

Guests: Brimelow, Peter, 1947- : Stein, Daniel. : Huffington, Arianna Stassinopoulos, 1950- : Botstein, Leon. : Koch, Ed, 1924- : Sharry, Frank. : Glasser, Ira.

6 June 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 3
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 5
Program details: Accusations fly, along with contradictory statistics, but beneath the noise we hear the great themes of the debate that Mr. Brimelow called for in the preceding debate. LB: "I think it is scandalous for us to sit here and to ascribe the persistent and terrible condition of the African-American poor in this country to immigrants, when in fact it is the responsibility of the long-term residents of this nation." ... ASH: "It is quite laughable for anybody who's been to California to listen to Mr. Sharry talk about all these invigorating immigrants.... Really, anybody who talks to the underclass that you mentioned in California knows that they feel very resentful, and if we want to avoid the kind of explosion of racism that we should avoid, we need to take care of the problem now." ... EK: "We are a country--and I agree with Peter on this--that is founded in the Judaeo-Christian ethic, in Western European mores, and I deplore those who want to shift us away from that, and it doesn't make any difference whether we come from Asia or Africa or Latin America, there is an American ethos, and the immigrants want to be a part of it."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1321
Program Number S1053, 2503

"Is the O. J. Simpson Trial a Scandal?"

Guests: Tigar, Michael.

11 July 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 4
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 6
Program details: We were six months into the O. J. Simpson trial and the relentless media coverage thereof. As WFB puts it, "Perhaps the most arresting feature of this half-hour is that it isn't a half-hour recording the O. J. Simpson trial. But don't go away--it is a half-hour devoted to the implications of the O. J. Simpson trial." In fact, this show is a sort of microcosm of the adversary system, to the audience's benefit. MT: "You and I, as persons of good will, would agree that unreasonable delay is wrong. You and I, as persons of good will, would agree that the truth-seeking process ought to have a primary importance. Where we part company is that you started the program by saying that the Simpson case reflects that the whole thing is rotten to the core and ought to be overthrown--the kind of polemical style that we associate with the young William Buckley of 1950 and not the more mature and conservative William Buckley--" WFB: "Who, by the way, was prophetically correct about everything he said."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1323
Program Number S1054, 2504

"Why Do So Many People Fear God?"

Guests: Wakefield, Dan. : Van den Haag, Ernest.

11 July 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 5
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 6
Program details: The phrase "fear God" in the title does not mean as in, say, Isaiah 6, but rather "fear to talk about God in public." A genial session exploring why Americans are so uncomfortable talking about their Maker. DW: "I've had the feeling that people who know now that I've gone back to church, that I've reclaimed my faith and so on, that they're afraid that I'm going to try to convert them ... And I have to suspect that behind that fear is the fear of the 'hound of Heaven'--that people are particularly afraid who know that that's back there, that that's in their own persona somewhere, and they want to push it away." ... WFB: "Is it socially embarrassing to be a Christian in a faculty?" EvdH: "Yes." WFB: "So one just shuts up about it?" EvdH: "Right. Well, not altogether. There are some more respectable types. You may be a Thomist, say, as a philosopher."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1324
Program Number S1055, 2505

"Should We Regulate the Use of Words?"

Guests: Pinker, Steven.

11 July 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 7
Program details: Mr. Pinker's new book had infuriated linguistic conservatives--among whom, count WFB--but in this relaxed conversation, host and guest agree as much as they disagree. SP: "All innovations, all words have to come from somewhere. Someone has to be the first person to use a word. They weren't handed down by a committee. And that means that all words at some point must have been slang, and words like 'mob,' 'bully,' 'sham,' 'jazz,' all were decried as horrible violence against the language.... If I was to say, 'It's been groovy rapping with you,' I would be embarrassing myself. And so in any judged, precise use of language, you have to develop an ear for what is likely to be durable and what is likely to be ephemeral."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1325
Program Number S1056, 2506

"What's Left of the State's Authority?"

Guests: Pataki, George E., 1945-

2 August 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 7
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 7
Program details: Governor Pataki had been a disappointment to the conservatives who had helped elect him the previous November, having done very little so far to cut spending and taxes as he had promised. In this low-key discussion, the Governor explains cogently why, in his view, spending cuts have to follow restructuring (in, say, welfare), and how the Federal Government fits in. WFB: "What is the advantage of the idea of block grants as distinguished from simply assuming the authority to tax and pay for your own welfare system?" GP: "I wouldn't have a problem with bypassing the federal requirement completely." WFB: "Because you'd be a winner." GP: "Because we'd be a winner. Right now I think it's somewhere between 14 and 18 billion dollars more each year New York taxpayers send to Washington than we get back."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1326
Program Number S1057, 2507

"Is the Anti-Terror Bill a Danger to Civil Liberties? Part I"

Guests: Toensing, Victoria. : Emerson, Steven. : Glasser, Ira. : Cole, David. : Zogby, James J. : Kinsley, Michael E.

10 August 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 8
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 8
Program details: This follow-up discussion is less wild and woolly than some of our recent ones, but sparks still fly--as do provocative ideas. IG: "We are in the beginning of a presidential campaign, and ... what [the candidates] are deathly afraid of [is] they don't want to be in the position of running for President in September of 1996 and have another bomb go off, and have their opponents say, 'Why didn't you do something?' "... WFB: "I simply refuse to acknowledge that the situation is imminent or threatened where people will be deported because they sent a bandage or a banana to an organization which is affiliated with terrorists." IG: "That's what's happening in Los Angeles right now." ... DC: "One of the interesting things about the reaction [to Oklahoma City] is that even when the facts become clear that it's not an immigrant--that it's a domestic threat--the bill that is proposed is directed ... primarily against 'foreign terrorism.' "
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1330
Program Number S1058, 2508

"Is the Anti-Terror Bill a Danger to Civil Liberties? Part II"

Guests: Toensing, Victoria. : Emerson, Steven. : Glasser, Ira. : Cole, David. : Zogby, James J. : Kinsley, Michael E.

10 August 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 8
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 8
Program details: This follow-up discussion is less wild and woolly than some of our recent ones, but sparks still fly--as do provocative ideas. IG: "We are in the beginning of a presidential campaign, and ... what [the candidates] are deathly afraid of [is] they don't want to be in the position of running for President in September of 1996 and have another bomb go off, and have their opponents say, 'Why didn't you do something?' "... WFB: "I simply refuse to acknowledge that the situation is imminent or threatened where people will be deported because they sent a bandage or a banana to an organization which is affiliated with terrorists." IG: "That's what's happening in Los Angeles right now." ... DC: "One of the interesting things about the reaction [to Oklahoma City] is that even when the facts become clear that it's not an immigrant--that it's a domestic threat--the bill that is proposed is directed ... primarily against 'foreign terrorism.' "
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1331
Program Number S1059, 2509

"What's Ahead for the Catholic Church? Part I: The Role of Women"

Guests: McBrien, Richard P. : Fox, Thomas.

2 August 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 9
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 9
Program details: A brisk and informative discussion--with the occasional flare-up--between our conservative-Catholic host and two liberal-Catholic guests. TF: "I think that the history of the 20th century is going to show one of the most magnificent changes in Catholicism. It is the first century in which educated Catholic women are sharing their stories, have entered the fields of theology and are recording theology ..." WFB: "I don't completely understand your point, because I wouldn't have thought of theology as being affected by the sex of the person who explores theology." TF: "I think the whole point is that men often don't understand."... WFB: "To what extent does the development of theology depend on the acquiescence of the faithful, i.e., is this a means by which that which is true is sifted from that which is not true?" RM: "Well, you're making a distinction, I hope, between theology and doctrine. Theology is the human effort... to try to make sense of the faith. You put it fairly well, I think. Theology, like any science, tries to sift the true from the false, and most of the time what you end up with is the doubtful."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1327
Program Number S1060, 2510

"What's Ahead for the Catholic Church? Part II: Sexuality and Catholicism"

Guests: McBrien, Richard P. : Fox, Thomas.

2 August 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 9
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 9
Program details: A brisk and informative discussion--with the occasional flare-up--between our conservative-Catholic host and two liberal-Catholic guests. TF: "I think that the history of the 20th century is going to show one of the most magnificent changes in Catholicism. It is the first century in which educated Catholic women are sharing their stories, have entered the fields of theology and are recording theology ..." WFB: "I don't completely understand your point, because I wouldn't have thought of theology as being affected by the sex of the person who explores theology." TF: "I think the whole point is that men often don't understand."... WFB: "To what extent does the development of theology depend on the acquiescence of the faithful, i.e., is this a means by which that which is true is sifted from that which is not true?" RM: "Well, you're making a distinction, I hope, between theology and doctrine. Theology is the human effort... to try to make sense of the faith. You put it fairly well, I think. Theology, like any science, tries to sift the true from the false, and most of the time what you end up with is the doubtful."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1328
Program Number S1061, 2511

"Do We Have Too Much Government Regulation? Part I: Economic and Social Regulations"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pert] : Brown, Jerry, 1938- : Sowell, Thomas, 1930- : Goodman, John C. : Estrich, Susan. : Arrow, Kenneth.

2 October 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 10
Program details: A crackling series of shows on everything from lead poisoning in our inner cities to the use of DDT to curb malaria in Sri Lanka to the effect of a bank merger on the banks' employees. "You pays your money and you takes your choice," but all sides of the questions are brilliantly argued. JB: "When you can allow a Chemical Bank to merge with a Chase Manhattan and eliminate 10,000 jobs with no safety net, with nothing else there, that is immoral..." TS: "Is it less immoral if 20,000 people lose their jobs in very small businesses over the same period of time, as often happens?" ... JCG: "On average, it's probably true that the [Environmental Protection Agency] is killing more people than it's saving." ... PdP: "We spent $5.5 trillion [on welfare] since 1964, and there are more people in poverty than when we began. The experiment has simply failed." SE: "So what do you do with the kids?" PdP: "What you do is you start with a different philosophy. The philosophy is that everybody works and everybody earns, unless you're disabled." SE: "Right. So we've got a 16-year-old girl who's got a bad philosophy and a 16-year-old boy who's got a bad philosophy, and between them they create a 1-year-old child who needs to eat. What do you want to do now?"
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1332
Program Number S1062, 2512

"Do We Have Too Much Government Regulation? Part II: Economic and Social Regulations"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S.[Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Brown, Jerry, 1938- : Sowell, Thomas, 1930- : Goodman, John C. : Estrich, Susan. : Arrow, Kenneth.

2 October 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 10
Program details: A crackling series of shows on everything from lead poisoning in our inner cities to the use of DDT to curb malaria in Sri Lanka to the effect of a bank merger on the banks' employees. "You pays your money and you takes your choice," but all sides of the questions are brilliantly argued. JB: "When you can allow a Chemical Bank to merge with a Chase Manhattan and eliminate 10,000 jobs with no safety net, with nothing else there, that is immoral..." TS: "Is it less immoral if 20,000 people lose their jobs in very small businesses over the same period of time, as often happens?" ... JCG: "On average, it's probably true that the [Environmental Protection Agency] is killing more people than it's saving." ... PdP: "We spent $5.5 trillion [on welfare] since 1964, and there are more people in poverty than when we began. The experiment has simply failed." SE: "So what do you do with the kids?" PdP: "What you do is you start with a different philosophy. The philosophy is that everybody works and everybody earns, unless you're disabled." SE: "Right. So we've got a 16-year-old girl who's got a bad philosophy and a 16-year-old boy who's got a bad philosophy, and between them they create a 1-year-old child who needs to eat. What do you want to do now?"
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1333
Program Number S1063, 2513

"Do We Have Too Much Government Regulation? Part III: Health and Safety Regulations"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Brown, Jerry, 1938- : Sowell, Thomas, 1930- : Goodman, John C. : Estrich, Susan. : Arrow, Kenneth.

2 October 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 11
Program details: A crackling series of shows on everything from lead poisoning in our inner cities to the use of DDT to curb malaria in Sri Lanka to the effect of a bank merger on the banks' employees. "You pays your money and you takes your choice," but all sides of the questions are brilliantly argued. JB: "When you can allow a Chemical Bank to merge with a Chase Manhattan and eliminate 10,000 jobs with no safety net, with nothing else there, that is immoral..." TS: "Is it less immoral if 20,000 people lose their jobs in very small businesses over the same period of time, as often happens?" ... JCG: "On average, it's probably true that the [Environmental Protection Agency] is killing more people than it's saving." ... PdP: "We spent $5.5 trillion [on welfare] since 1964, and there are more people in poverty than when we began. The experiment has simply failed." SE: "So what do you do with the kids?" PdP: "What you do is you start with a different philosophy. The philosophy is that everybody works and everybody earns, unless you're disabled." SE: "Right. So we've got a 16-year-old girl who's got a bad philosophy and a 16-year-old boy who's got a bad philosophy, and between them they create a 1-year-old child who needs to eat. What do you want to do now?"
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1334
Program Number S1064, 2514

"Do We Have Too Much Government Regulation? Part IV: Health and Safety Regulations"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Brown, Jerry, 1938- : Sowell, Thomas, 1930- : Goodman, John C. : Estrich, Susan.

2 October 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 11
Program details: A crackling series of shows on everything from lead poisoning in our inner cities to the use of DDT to curb malaria in Sri Lanka to the effect of a bank merger on the banks' employees. "You pays your money and you takes your choice," but all sides of the questions are brilliantly argued. JB: "When you can allow a Chemical Bank to merge with a Chase Manhattan and eliminate 10,000 jobs with no safety net, with nothing else there, that is immoral..." TS: "Is it less immoral if 20,000 people lose their jobs in very small businesses over the same period of time, as often happens?" ... JCG: "On average, it's probably true that the [Environmental Protection Agency] is killing more people than it's saving." ... PdP: "We spent $5.5 trillion [on welfare] since 1964, and there are more people in poverty than when we began. The experiment has simply failed." SE: "So what do you do with the kids?" PdP: "What you do is you start with a different philosophy. The philosophy is that everybody works and everybody earns, unless you're disabled." SE: "Right. So we've got a 16-year-old girl who's got a bad philosophy and a 16-year-old boy who's got a bad philosophy, and between them they create a 1-year-old child who needs to eat. What do you want to do now?"
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1335
Program Number S1065, 2515

"Is Racism the Cause of Black Failure?"

Guests: D'Souza, Dinesh, 1961- : Loury, Glenn C.

10 November 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 7
Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 11
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 12
Program details: Mr. Loury, as WFB recounts in his introduction, "had taken such exception to Mr. D'Souza's latest book as to resign from an organization (the American Enterprise Institute) with which they were both affiliated. Their exchanges on this show are civil, and it is clear that they agree on more things than not; but as to the points of disagreement, neither is going to convince the other. GL: Is the point here that there's a much higher rate of teenage births to black girls, or is the point that American society is plagued with a problem of young, unmarried girls having babies?" DD: "I certainly don't disagree that we're faced with certain problems that are American problems.... And yet, in a sense, the rain doesn't fall evenly in all communities.... I think it is simply mindless to deny that we do have ethnic groups in this country, not just whites and blacks ... but we have the Jews, the Irish, the Italians, and so on, and there are perceptible differences between groups."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1336
Program Number S1066, 2516

"Is Hollywood a Lost Cause?"

Guests: Heston, Charlton.

10 November 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 8
Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 12
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 12
Program details: To the title question, Mr. Heston would give a qualified "No." There are, he says, "far more young conservatives among actors and writers and directors now," and Hollywood does respond, though slowly, to public pressure--so that, as Mr. Buckley puts it, "a depiction of a minister or a priest doesn't have to show him as a bigamist or an adulterer or a sodomist." Still, Hollywood is a left-wing place. CH: "The other explanation that has occurred to me is that actors and writers make their livings with their imaginations, with their feelings, and thus they put a great deal of faith in them. I may play a part in which I may have to burst into tears at the death of a character that hasn't even been cast yet... It seems to me plausible that therefore actors rely on their emotions for making intellectual decisions, which is not a wise move."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1337
Program Number S1067, 2517

"Is Democracy in America Working?"

Guests: Kinsley, Michael E.

10 November 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 9
Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 13
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 13
Program details: The occasion for having Mr. Kinsley as guest rather than moderator is the publication of his book Big Babies, which, as WFB glosses it, "tells us that the American voter is a baby in that he wants one thing in principle, another in practice." The conversation starts with democracy per se, then moves to the uses of government. MK: "There is a role for society, through its proxy, the government, to slightly rejigger the economic consequences of unalloyed capitalism. I am a great believer in free-market capitalism. It's the most efficient way to produce prosperity, but it does exaggerate or exacerbate the workings of fortune, of luck. And there is nothing wrong with society deciding we are going to even it out a little bit--not a lot, just a little bit."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1338
Program Number S1068, 2518

"How Do We Cope with Young Black Crime?"

Guests: Koch, Ed, 1924-

5 December 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 10
Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 14
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 13
Program details: Mr. Koch had recently reflected publicly on the work of a professor who had found that the incidence of crime among young black men who were married and working was no higher than that among young white men. So how do we get young black men to marry and work? A splendid half-hour, even if Messrs. Buckley and Koch don't entirely arrive at an answer. EK: "The fact is that we have a system that says if you're married you can't get welfare and therefore it was a stupidity to set the welfare system up that way." WFB: "Now, you were part of the Democratic establishment...Why, in the dozens of years that these laws were accommodated, didn't you struggle against them?" EK: "Well, I must say that I have always been someone who has taken on my own party ... but to expect that I could change the welfare laws in this country is expecting a little too much even from Ed Koch."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1339
Program Number S1069, 2519

"Is the Flat Tax a Better Tax? Part I"

Guests: Goodman, John C. : Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Brown, Jerry, 1938- : Thurow, Lester C. : Kuttner, Robert. : McGovern, George S. (George Stanley), 1922- : Mann, Steven.

4 April 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 15
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 14
Program details: After the debate there was still plenty more to say, and these shows move along briskly. LT: "Why is it, in the entire industrial world, everybody has at least what they think is a progressive income tax-- They're all wrong? ..." WFB: "It's a hangover from the dogmatic socialism from which people have been weaned away as a result of the excesses of the Soviet Union. I think it's fair to say that Sweden, certainly England, certainly France, to a certain extent Germany, are pulling back." ... GM: "We've been living under the progressive income tax ever since 1916. American capitalism is doing just fine. We don't have socialism, we don't have Marxism." WFB: "I don't think it is. The same number of people who were poor twenty years ago are poor now--13 to 14 per cent. Something is not working." GM: "Well, you're not going to lift them out of poverty by a tax break for the rich." WFB: "Yes, we are. This is our big surprise. We're going to do that."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1312
Program Number S1070, 2520

"Is the Flat Tax a Better Tax? Part II"

Guests: Goodman, John C. : Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Brown, Jerry, 1938- : Thurow, Lester C. : Kuttner, Robert. : McGovern, George S. (George Stanley), 1922- : Mann, Steven.

4 April 1995

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 15
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 14
Program details: After the debate there was still plenty more to say, and these shows move along briskly. LT: "Why is it, in the entire industrial world, everybody has at least what they think is a progressive income tax-- They're all wrong? ..." WFB: "It's a hangover from the dogmatic socialism from which people have been weaned away as a result of the excesses of the Soviet Union. I think it's fair to say that Sweden, certainly England, certainly France, to a certain extent Germany, are pulling back." ... GM: "We've been living under the progressive income tax ever since 1916. American capitalism is doing just fine. We don't have socialism, we don't have Marxism." WFB: "I don't think it is. The same number of people who were poor twenty years ago are poor now--13 to 14 per cent. Something is not working." GM: "Well, you're not going to lift them out of poverty by a tax break for the rich." WFB: "Yes, we are. This is our big surprise. We're going to do that."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1313
Program Number S1071, 2521

"Goldwater, Old and New"

Guests: Edwards, Lee. : Brookhiser, Richard.

5 December 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 11
Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 16
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 15
Program details: Barry Goldwater had been dismaying his old allies with some of his recent stands--e.g., in favor of gays in the military, against restrictions on abortion. The question before the house is: "What's up with Barry?" It is Mr. Edwards's contention that "Senator Goldwater has personalized these issues--influenced by his first wife (a founder of Planned Parenthood) and by a gay grandson. Nonetheless, I call him the most important loser in American politics.... Nobody's going around saying: 'I'm standing on the shoulders of Eugene McCarthy and George McGovern.' And yet Republicans are going around and saying: 'We're standing on the shoulders of Barry Goldwater.' "
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1341
Program Number S1072, 2522

"Multiculturalism and Stanford University"

Guests: Robinson, Peter, 1957- : Sacks, David O. : Thiel, Peter A.

5 December 1995

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 12
Publicity File: Box/Folder 139 : 17
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 15
Program details: Stanford had famously caved in to Jesse Jackson's chants of "Hey, hey, ho, ho, Western Culture's got to go," and abolished its core curriculum. Messrs. Sacks and Thiel had chronicled the result in The Diversity Myth: Multiculturalism and the Politics of Intolerance at Stanford. Mr. Robinson, meanwhile, had suffered through the Stanford MBA program and found traces of multiculturalism even there. PT: "The kinds of things one reads in the new multicultural curriculum are not things like the Koran or Confucius, but they are things like Lee Iacocca's Car Buyer's Bill of Rights as a comparative study to the United States Bill of Rights; the writing of Chief Seattle contrasted with Plato and Aristotle." ... DS: "The protestors of the 1960s were so successful that many of them have just stayed on campus. They're still occupying administration buildings, but now they are the administrators and faculty."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1340
Program Number S1073, 2523

"Why We Should Legalize Drugs: Part I"

Guests: Szasz, Thomas Stephen, 1920- : Sweet, Robert W. : Nadelmann, Ethan Avram. : Duke, Steven.

16 January 1996

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 16
Program details: Mr. Buckley and all four of his guests agree that the War on Drugs has failed and should be ended. But these shows are no exercise in redundancy; each participant came to his conclusion by a different route, and each of the shows examines a different aspect of the problem: the first, the cost of the war; the second, approaches to legalization; the third, political difficulties in the way of reform. SD: "My position is that we should repeal prohibition for any drug for which there is a major black market. I'm not a libertarian and I would have no difficulty with prohibiting some drugs, as long as the prohibition was enforceable, as long as we didn't wreck the country in the process." ... TS: "I think this is a posture that many American politicians have taken: 'I am waging a war on evil.' The Evil Empire--instead of Communism, we have heroin."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1342
Program Number S1074, 2524

"Why We Should Legalize Drugs: Part II"

Guests: Szasz, Thomas Stephen, 1920- : Sweet, Robert W. : Nadelmann, Ethan Avram. : Duke, Steven.

16 January 1996

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 16
Program details: Mr. Buckley and all four of his guests agree that the War on Drugs has failed and should be ended. But these shows are no exercise in redundancy; each participant came to his conclusion by a different route, and each of the shows examines a different aspect of the problem: the first, the cost of the war; the second, approaches to legalization; the third, political difficulties in the way of reform. SD: "My position is that we should repeal prohibition for any drug for which there is a major black market. I'm not a libertarian and I would have no difficulty with prohibiting some drugs, as long as the prohibition was enforceable, as long as we didn't wreck the country in the process." ... TS: "I think this is a posture that many American politicians have taken: 'I am waging a war on evil.' The Evil Empire--instead of Communism, we have heroin."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1343
Program Number S1075, 2525

"Why We Should Legalize Drugs: Part III"

Guests: Szasz, Thomas Stephen, 1920- : Sweet, Robert W. : Nadelmann, Ethan Avram. : Duke, Steven.

16 January 1996

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 17
Program details: Mr. Buckley and all four of his guests agree that the War on Drugs has failed and should be ended. But these shows are no exercise in redundancy; each participant came to his conclusion by a different route, and each of the shows examines a different aspect of the problem: the first, the cost of the war; the second, approaches to legalization; the third, political difficulties in the way of reform. SD: "My position is that we should repeal prohibition for any drug for which there is a major black market. I'm not a libertarian and I would have no difficulty with prohibiting some drugs, as long as the prohibition was enforceable, as long as we didn't wreck the country in the process." ... TS: "I think this is a posture that many American politicians have taken: 'I am waging a war on evil.' The Evil Empire--instead of Communism, we have heroin."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1344
Program Number S1076, 2526

"The Media vs. Democracy"

Guests: Fallows, James M. : Rich, Frank.

24 January 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 13
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 17
Program details: The fact that all three participants are in general agreement on the point at issue does not dull this spirited session. JF: "The particular thing which drives me crazy is the complex of behaviors summed up by the word handling. Ninety per cent of the instinct of powerful political reporters is, when any issue comes up, the subject doesn't become the issue itself but the handling of the issue: not Chechnya, but Yeltsin's handling of Chechnya, and Clinton's handling of the budget. And handling becomes this great sluice into which all attention goes as opposed to the fundamentals of the question." ... FR: "If you have a bunch of people who behave like clowns on television on these Sunday-morning shows where they're yelling at each other, and you see it's So-and-So from Time or the New York Times, the Washington Post--it doesn't matter-- ... you think: Well, they're all behaving like idiots, and how can we trust any of their institutions for news?"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1345
Program Number S1077, 2527

"Constitutional Logjam?"

Guests: Reid, David. : Taggart, John Y.

24 January 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 14
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 3
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 18
Program details: America was still suffering through the Government Shutdown: the impasse between the Republican Congress and President Clinton, in which the President had vetoed the Budget Reconciliation Bill, and neither House had the two-thirds majority needed to override. WFB: "Does the logic of the situation suggest that, at the end, the House would simply have to exert its money power to actually prevail, or is this simply a politically inconceivable turn?" JT: "Well, if by exerting the money power you mean having our nation default, I would regard that as an extraordinarily serious and most unfortunate way of exercising the money power. If by exercising the money power you mean passing individual bills which do particular things and then, when the President vetoes them, overriding his veto, I would have no objection to that at all."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1346
Program Number S1078, 2528

"The Rhetoric of Abortion"

Guests: Alvare, Helen. : Wolf, Naomi.

24 January 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 15
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 4
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 18
Program details: Ms. Wolf had just provoked a firestorm with her essay in The New Republic in which, as Mr. Buckley summarizes it, "she absolutely defends the right of the mother to abort the fetus, but absolutely classifies the act as evil." (Ms. Wolf, in the course of this often profound discussion, qualifies that second "absolutely": "a necessary evil in many cases.") NW: "I am so glad to have the chance to talk with you and with other representatives of the pro-life movement, who, I have to say, I had been raised all my life to demonize and to see as sort of these fanatical misogynists. I have to reckon with the fact that many of the people I have heard from on that side of the divide are thoughtful, ethical people who respect women and who believe that it is of deep moral concern and even deep religious concern to raise the status of women in society."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1347
Program Number S1079, 2529

"Regulating Cybersmut: Part I"

Guests: Glasser, Ira. : Cleaver, Cathleen. : Huffington, Arianna Stassinopoulos, 1950- : Estrich, Susan. : Barlow, John P. (John Perry) : Dyson, Esther, 1951- : Kinsley, Michael E. : Hoffman, Reid.

23 February 1996

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 5
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 19
Program details: A lively, not to say rambunctious, follow-up. MK: "A local prosecutor in Germany decided he wanted to regulate the Internet. All he cared about was ... Munich. But the reality was, the only way that CompuServe could address his concerns and obey the law that he was laying down was to apply that law to the whole world." ... CC: "People that are opposing the Communications Decency Act are advocating a really big philosophical shift in the law. Usually our society has embraced laws that make people responsible who are emitting harmful material, whether it is obscenity or it is toxic waste, not require parents ... to buy filters to protect their homes from toxic waste." ... SE: "Arianna asks why the government shouldn't [regulate the Internet]. It's a very simple, short, clear little answer, and it's called the First Amendment."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1349
Program Number S1080, 2530

"Regulating Cybersmut: Part II"

Guests: Glasser, Ira. : Cleaver, Cathleen. : Hoffman, Reid. : Huffington, Arianna Stassinopoulos, 1950- : Estrich, Susan. : Barlow, John P. (John Perry) : Dyson, Esther, 1951- : Kinsley, Michael E.

23 February 1996

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 5
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 19
Program details: A lively, not to say rambunctious, follow-up. MK: "A local prosecutor in Germany decided he wanted to regulate the Internet. All he cared about was ... Munich. But the reality was, the only way that CompuServe could address his concerns and obey the law that he was laying down was to apply that law to the whole world." ... CC: "People that are opposing the Communications Decency Act are advocating a really big philosophical shift in the law. Usually our society has embraced laws that make people responsible who are emitting harmful material, whether it is obscenity or it is toxic waste, not require parents ... to buy filters to protect their homes from toxic waste." ... SE: "Arianna asks why the government shouldn't [regulate the Internet]. It's a very simple, short, clear little answer, and it's called the First Amendment."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1350
Program Number S1081, 2531

"Dole and the Conservative Problem: Part I"

Guests: Forbes, Steve, 1947- : Flanigan, Peter M. : Brookhiser, Richard.

4 April 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 16
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 20
Program details: Bob Dole had clinched the GOP nomination with his win in the California primary, and although conservatives had found much to admire in him over the years, he was far from their beau ideal. All the participants in these three shows are conservatives, but each has his own vantage point from which to view Mr. Dole and the campaign. PF: "I think Dole has a relatively good ... record generally on conservative issues. The problem with him is, one, that his whole life has been cutting deals, and conservatives don't like deals, they like principle; and two, he has not, or at least not yet, been able to articulate a vision." ... WFB: "Can't somebody say: 'Okay, I'm a technician and I live in a democratic republic, I'll be instructed by the majority, and the majority seem to want this, so I'll work real hard to give it to them?'"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1351
Program Number S1082, 2532

"Dole and the Conservative Problem: Part II"

Guests: Forbes, Steve, 1947- : Flanigan, Peter M. : Brookhiser, Richard. : Black, Conrad.

4 April 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 16
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 20
Program details: Bob Dole had clinched the GOP nomination with his win in the California primary, and although conservatives had found much to admire in him over the years, he was far from their beau ideal. All the participants in these three shows are conservatives, but each has his own vantage point from which to view Mr. Dole and the campaign. PF: "I think Dole has a relatively good ... record generally on conservative issues. The problem with him is, one, that his whole life has been cutting deals, and conservatives don't like deals, they like principle; and two, he has not, or at least not yet, been able to articulate a vision." ... WFB: "Can't somebody say: 'Okay, I'm a technician and I live in a democratic republic, I'll be instructed by the majority, and the majority seem to want this, so I'll work real hard to give it to them?'"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1352
Program Number S1083, 2533

"Dole and the Conservative Problem: Part III"

Guests: Forbes, Steve, 1947- : Black, Conrad. : Flanigan, Peter M. : Brookhiser, Richard.

4 April 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 16
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 20
Program details: Bob Dole had clinched the GOP nomination with his win in the California primary, and although conservatives had found much to admire in him over the years, he was far from their beau ideal. All the participants in these three shows are conservatives, but each has his own vantage point from which to view Mr. Dole and the campaign. PF: "I think Dole has a relatively good ... record generally on conservative issues. The problem with him is, one, that his whole life has been cutting deals, and conservatives don't like deals, they like principle; and two, he has not, or at least not yet, been able to articulate a vision." ... WFB: "Can't somebody say: 'Okay, I'm a technician and I live in a democratic republic, I'll be instructed by the majority, and the majority seem to want this, so I'll work real hard to give it to them?'"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1353
Program Number S1084, 2534

"The Problem of Economic Survival"

Guests: Thurow, Lester C.

7 May 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 140 : 7
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 7
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 21
Program details: Mr. Thurow had just published a book titled The Future of Capitalism: How Today's Economic Forces Shape Tomorrow's World, and that becomes the theme of this fascinating half-hour. WFB: "What would you say the future of capitalism is?" LT: "It's going to be different. I use the metaphor of punctuated equilibrium from biology, where you have 130 million years of dinosaurs, then you have a period, maybe as short as 10,000 years, which biologists call punctuated equilibrium, and out the other side comes mammals. The question is, What's coming out the other side? .. . Well, one thing is we're moving from basically an era of natural-resource-based industries to an era of man-made brainpower industries ..."--with all sorts of implications concerning who owns the brainpower and how that affects the workforce and standard of living in First versus Third World countries.
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1354
Program Number S1085, 2535

"Is There a Hitler in Ourselves?"

Guests: Goldhagen, Daniel Jonah.

7 May 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 99 : 17
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 8
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 21
Program details: The title question, Mr. Buckley tells us, "recalls a book published in Great Britain not so long after the end of the Second World War in which the author, Victor Gollancz, wondered out loud whether such evil instincts as produced Hitler lay inchoate in human beings at large. The question, the gravest one can ask about the human race, is sharply etched" in Mr. Goldhagen's new book. A grim but profound discussion of this disquieting subject. DIG: "People are socialized by the societies in which they grow up. And in many societies, historically, people have believed all kinds of things about other groups of people which have led them to commit acts which we abhor." ... "Learning is not an inoculation against prejudice; cultivation is not an inoculation against prejudice.""
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1355
Program Number S1086, 2536

"O. J. Simpson and the Racial Question"

Guests: Dershowitz, Alan M.

20 May 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 1
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 9
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 22
Program details: Firing Line had looked at the O.J. Simpson trial in midstream (see Firing Line s01053) and now comes back for the aftermath. As Mr. Buckley frames the question, "The intention ... is not to prove that O.J. killed his former wife--in a half-hour, we couldn't prove, against a disputatious guest, that John Wilkes Booth killed Abraham Lincoln. The intention is to focus on the racial question"--i.e., the fact that some 70 per cent of blacks believe O.J. was innocent, while some 70 per cent of whites believe he was guilty. Think what you will about Mr. Dershowitz's role in the trial, this show offers a brilliant exploration of criminal law from the viewpoint of the criminal lawyer. AD: "Think about what a blunder [letting Simpson try on the glove] was on the part of the prosecution.... They gave the defendant an opportunity to go right up to the jury box, look them straight in the eye, and say: 'It doesn't fit; it's too small, see?' At that point any doubts about whether he had to testify were obviated. He didn't have to testify--he had already testified without a cross-examination. It was about the dumbest thing I've ever seen a lawyer do in any courtroom in the 32 years I've been practicing law."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1357
Program Number S1087, 2537

"Understanding the Fourth Amendment: Part I"

Guests: Graglia, Lino A. : Dershowitz, Alan M. : Lewis, Anthony, 1927-

20 May 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 2
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 22
Program details: The Fourth Amendment says: "The right of the people to be secure ... against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated ..." It took 112 years for the Supreme Court to decide that the appropriate remedy for an unreasonable search was the exclusion of the evidence from trial, and yet another 48 years to decide that the law applied to state and local police--"about as perverse and unreasonable a creation of a rule as you can imagine," in Mr. Graglia's view, "because it necessarily rewards only the guilty" and does nothing to protect the victim of a truly unreasonable search where there is no evidence to be seized. This no-holds-barred engagement is as fast-moving as they come, with substance and style in equal measure. LG: "... That's liberalism, and that's what Alan's for. The Supreme Court is influenced only in that direction." AL: "Lino, stop, please! You are telling me ... that Chief Justice Rehnquist and Nino Scalia are waiting for the latest bulletin from Alan Dershowitz to know how to vote?"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1358
Program Number S1088, 2538

"Understanding the Fourth Amendment: Part II"

Guests: Graglia, Lino A. : Dershowitz, Alan M. : Lewis, Anthony, 1927-

20 May 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 2
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 23
Program details: The Fourth Amendment says: "The right of the people to be secure ... against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated ..." It took 112 years for the Supreme Court to decide that the appropriate remedy for an unreasonable search was the exclusion of the evidence from trial, and yet another 48 years to decide that the law applied to state and local police--"about as perverse and unreasonable a creation of a rule as you can imagine," in Mr. Graglia's view, "because it necessarily rewards only the guilty" and does nothing to protect the victim of a truly unreasonable search where there is no evidence to be seized. This no-holds-barred engagement is as fast-moving as they come, with substance and style in equal measure. LG: "... That's liberalism, and that's what Alan's for. The Supreme Court is influenced only in that direction." AL: "Lino, stop, please! You are telling me ... that Chief Justice Rehnquist and Nino Scalia are waiting for the latest bulletin from Alan Dershowitz to know how to vote?"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1359
Program Number S1089, 2539

"Integrity and Politics"

Guests: Carter, Stephen L.

7 May 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 4
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 11
Transcript: Box/Folder 187 : 23
Program details: Time out from the minutiae of the election campaign to consider, as WFB puts it, "the ethics of contemporary democratic practices." A session worthy of its subject. WFB: "During the big debate on the Panama Canal Treaty,... Senator Goldwater was in favor of the treaty but he voted against it. Somebody said to him: 'Why did you vote against it?' 'Well,' he said, 'I had 10,000 telegrams on the subject, and 9,900 were against the treaty.' Now is that a form of expiation that satisfies your criteria of integrity?" SLC: "See, the trouble is, it depends on how Burkean you want to be about representation. I deeply believe in the vision of our representative as the trustee, as the person who we elect because we trust his judgment and we want him to bring his moral capacity and intellect to bear on the problems of the day.... The trouble is that the Goldwater comment reflects what most representatives in fact do, which is very much the opposite."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1356
Program Number S1090, 2601

"Is Downsizing Good or Bad? Part I"

Guests: Shrum, Robert. : Kuttner, Robert. : Jasinowski, Jerry J. : Levy, David A. : Hormats, Robert D. : Stern, Andrew. : Green, Mark J. : Luttwak, Edward.

29 May 1996

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 12
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 1
Program details: The vigorous discussion ranges far beyond the narrow topic of the show's title to encompass America's economic performance since World War II, causes of inflation, profit sharing, and much else. Mr. Stern: "Unions are the only effective, long-term anti-poverty program that works. If workers have power in the marketplace we don't need to see the government involved at all in this process." ... Mr. Luttwak: "Central-bankism has become the replacement of Christianity throughout the Western world. Central-bankism holds that for real people to be unemployed is a thing more easily tolerated than to have an inflation rate of even 3 per cent per annum. The fight against the devil has been called off. There is now the fight against inflation." ... Mr. Green: "One year ago we had the unprecedented phenomenon of the stock market going wild, profits up, productivity finally going up, and real pay--median real pay--going down. Workers are entitled to say: 'What the hell is going on here?'"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1361
Program Number S1091, 2602

"Is Downsizing Good or Bad? Part II"

Guests: Shrum, Robert. : Kuttner, Robert. : Jasinowski, Jerry J. : Levy, David A. : Hormats, Robert D. : Stern, Andrew. : Green, Mark J. : Luttwak, Edward.

29 May 1996

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 12
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 1
Program details: The vigorous discussion ranges far beyond the narrow topic of the show's title to encompass America's economic performance since World War II, causes of inflation, profit sharing, and much else. Mr. Stern: "Unions are the only effective, long-term anti-poverty program that works. If workers have power in the marketplace we don't need to see the government involved at all in this process." ... Mr. Luttwak: "Central-bankism has become the replacement of Christianity throughout the Western world. Central-bankism holds that for real people to be unemployed is a thing more easily tolerated than to have an inflation rate of even 3 per cent per annum. The fight against the devil has been called off. There is now the fight against inflation." ... Mr. Green: "One year ago we had the unprecedented phenomenon of the stock market going wild, profits up, productivity finally going up, and real pay--median real pay--going down. Workers are entitled to say: 'What the hell is going on here?'"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1362
Program Number S1092, 2603

"Africa: A Multicultural Myth"

Guests: Lefkowitz, Mary R., 1935-

11 July 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 3
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 13
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 2
Program details: The multicultural myth in question is that much of what we think of as Greek contributions to Western civilization were really stolen from Africa--or at any rate from Egypt. Professor Lefkowitz had aroused a hornet's nest by attacking that myth, but, as she reports in this absorbing conversation--which ranges from Cleopatra's parentage to Plato's philosophy to modern cultural relativism--"the fuss was subsiding and the myth was crumbling." ML: "If we want people to learn about Egypt and ancient Africa, the place to begin is not with Eurocentric mythology.... It's with real Africa and what we can know about that through Egyptian documents and any other information that's out there."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1363
Program Number S1093, 2604

"Have We Learned Anything about the Good Society?"

Guests: Galbraith, John Kenneth, 1908-2006.

11 July 1996

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 14
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 2
Program details: We may not learn much we didn't know before from this encounter between two old friends and adversaries, but they do it so well. WFB: "My point is that all these rich people to whom you constantly make reference are not people who, because they become rich, hurt other people." JKG: "I wouldn't be so sure of that, Bill. It seems to me that as one looks at the modem corporate structure, there is an allocation of income to the upper brackets of the corporation which has been growing enormously in return as compared with that going to the mass of the workers. And I can't but think that that has been to the advantage of the corporate executives and to the disadvantage of those whose income is stable or declining." WFB: "There weren't any workers till Bill Gates quit school, went into his garage, and invented Microsoft. Now there are 40,000 of them. I think that's good, and if he ends up with $13 billion, I couldn't care less."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1364
Program Number S1094, 2605

"Does Every State Legislature Need a Boss?"

Guests: Bulger, William M.

11 July 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 5
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 15
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 3
Program details: Mr. Bulger, who had often been described as the boss of the Massachusetts State Senate, addresses the title question: "I think the answer is no; but a leader, yes." This genial and substantive discussion ranges from the difficulties of being a Democrat to the unconscionability of the Boston busing decision of 1974, which "was unjust because it only came in upon the children of the poor, and it was unnecessary because it came in upon the people who were living the most integrated lives, the people who lived within the borders of the city of Boston." ... WFB: "You have a hard affiliation with a political party that has given you the most trouble in respect of a concrete situation." WMB: "That's true. And the Democratic Party, I would say, 'Shame on it for its behavior.'... Are you looking for an apostate here today?" WFB: "I'm looking for hope." WB: "So am I. So am I."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1365
Program Number S1095, 2606

"Should Affirmative Action Be Terminated? Part I"

Guests: Graglia, Lino A. : Abram, Morris B. : Guinier, Lani. : Botstein, Leon. : Lichtman, Judith L.

23 July 1996

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 16
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 4
Program details: In the free-for-all follow-up discussion, he who talks the fastest sets the tone--and in this case, that means that Professor Graglia's favorite topic, college admissions, gets the bulk of the air time. But that's fine: it's a topic about which all the participants care deeply and speak well. Ms. Guinier: "When you use tests to automatically admit [a group of people]... without regard to their ethics, to their character, you are basically asserting that your value is simply: Can you think fast and have you been brought up by a family that has the resources to coach you to take this test? ..." Mr. Graglia: "Unfortunately we cannot ask applicants to law school: 'Are you highly moral? Are you going to behave ethically?' They're all going to say yes, and the least ethical will probably say yes the most persuasively."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1366
Program Number S1096, 2607

"Should Affirmative Action Be Terminated? Part II"

Guests: Graglia, Lino A. : Abram, Morris B. : Guinier, Lani. : Botstein, Leon. : Lichtman, Judith L.

23 July 1996

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 16
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 4
Program details: In the free-for-all follow-up discussion, he who talks the fastest sets the tone--and in this case, that means that Professor Graglia's favorite topic, college admissions, gets the bulk of the air time. But that's fine: it's a topic about which all the participants care deeply and speak well. Ms. Guinier: "When you use tests to automatically admit [a group of people]... without regard to their ethics, to their character, you are basically asserting that your value is simply: Can you think fast and have you been brought up by a family that has the resources to coach you to take this test? ..." Mr. Graglia: "Unfortunately we cannot ask applicants to law school: 'Are you highly moral? Are you going to behave ethically?' They're all going to say yes, and the least ethical will probably say yes the most persuasively."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1367
Program Number S1097, 2608

"Presidential Year: The Responsibility of the Press: Part I"

Guests: Isaacson, Walter. : Klein, Joe. : Koch, Ed, 1924- : Bozell , L. Brent, III.

29 August 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 6
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 17
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 5
Program details: A good-tempered discussion, but one which in substance is often scathing about the participants' profession. EK: "I do believe that there is a double standard, and that the media is far more partial to the Democrats in a laudatory way. I'm a Democrat and I'm voting for Clinton, but facts are facts." ... WFB: "Mr. Klein, let me ask you this after your years of association with Newsweek: Does a magazine of that size and scope attempt to elaborate a line, or it is completely atomistic in the sense that you write what you want to write, and he writes what he wants to write, etc., and then a line sort of gestates?" JK: "There is a line. It has nothing to do with ideology, though. It has everything to do with total bias in favor of the good story. If this is the golden age of anything it is the golden age of marketing, and we are in a fierce, fierce competitive environment."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1369
Program Number S1098, 2609

"Presidential Year: The Responsibility of the Press: Part II"

Guests: Isaacson, Walter. : Klein, Joe. : Koch, Ed, 1924- : Bozell, L. Brent, III.

29 August 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 6
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 17
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 5
Program details: A good-tempered discussion, but one which in substance is often scathing about the participants' profession. EK: "I do believe that there is a double standard, and that the media is far more partial to the Democrats in a laudatory way. I'm a Democrat and I'm voting for Clinton, but facts are facts." ... WFB: "Mr. Klein, let me ask you this after your years of association with Newsweek: Does a magazine of that size and scope attempt to elaborate a line, or it is completely atomistic in the sense that you write what you want to write, and he writes what he wants to write, etc., and then a line sort of gestates?" JK: "There is a line. It has nothing to do with ideology, though. It has everything to do with total bias in favor of the good story. If this is the golden age of anything it is the golden age of marketing, and we are in a fierce, fierce competitive environment."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1370
Program Number S1099, 2610

"Presidential Year: The Responsibility of the Press: Part III"

Guests: Isaacson, Walter. : Klein, Joe. : Koch, Ed, 1924- : Bozell, L. Brent, III.

29 August 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 6
Publicity File: Box/Folder 140 : 17
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 5
Program details: A good-tempered discussion, but one which in substance is often scathing about the participants' profession. EK: "I do believe that there is a double standard, and that the media is far more partial to the Democrats in a laudatory way. I'm a Democrat and I'm voting for Clinton, but facts are facts." ... WFB: "Mr. Klein, let me ask you this after your years of association with Newsweek: Does a magazine of that size and scope attempt to elaborate a line, or it is completely atomistic in the sense that you write what you want to write, and he writes what he wants to write, etc., and then a line sort of gestates?" JK: "There is a line. It has nothing to do with ideology, though. It has everything to do with total bias in favor of the good story. If this is the golden age of anything it is the golden age of marketing, and we are in a fierce, fierce competitive environment."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1371
Program Number S1100, 2611

"Environment and Property Rights: Part I"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Gramm, Wendy Lee. : Wallop, Malcolm. : Pope, Carl. : Linden, Eugene. : Krupp, Fred.

8 October 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 7
Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 6
Program details: Environmental legislation is something about which, as WFB puts it, "much has been written, but about which not all that many people have detailed ideas beyond that they wish a long life for louseworts and a short, abrupt life for dirty air and unclean water." Our guests have all been deeply involved in the controversies over what level of pollution is acceptable and at what point the incremental improvement poses unacceptable costs. One sample: CP: "Let me ask some questions, because I am curious. Would the three of you favor full funding of the wetland reserve? ... When farmers want to protect their wetlands by selling an easement to the Federal Government, would you say to the Congress, 'This is an important national priority which should be funded'? Are you willing to put your money behind these ideas?" MW: "You know how [the law] was written, and it was written that if your dog had a favorite tree in the backyard you could have a wetland reserve payment from the Federal Government." CP: "Wait a minute, Senator Wallop. I actually think that is a very funny line, as I would expect from you, but it is actually not fair to the legislation."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1372
Program Number S1101, 2612

"Environment and Property Rights: Part II"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Gramm, Wendy Lee. : Wallop, Malcolm. : Pope, Carl. : Linden, Eugene. : Krupp, Fred.

8 October 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 7
Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 7
Program details: Environmental legislation is something about which, as WFB puts it, "much has been written, but about which not all that many people have detailed ideas beyond that they wish a long life for louseworts and a short, abrupt life for dirty air and unclean water." Our guests have all been deeply involved in the controversies over what level of pollution is acceptable and at what point the incremental improvement poses unacceptable costs. One sample: CP: "Let me ask some questions, because I am curious. Would the three of you favor full funding of the wetland reserve? ... When farmers want to protect their wetlands by selling an easement to the Federal Government, would you say to the Congress, 'This is an important national priority which should be funded'? Are you willing to put your money behind these ideas?" MW: "You know how [the law] was written, and it was written that if your dog had a favorite tree in the backyard you could have a wetland reserve payment from the Federal Government." CP: "Wait a minute, Senator Wallop. I actually think that is a very funny line, as I would expect from you, but it is actually not fair to the legislation."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1373
Program Number S1102, 2613

"The Republican Desolation: Part I"

Guests: Buckley, John. : O'Sullivan, John. : O'Beirne, Kate Walsh.

8 November 1996

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 7
Program details: The title of this show, as WFB explains, "is applicable, of course, only to the presidential race. Other races for Senate seats, House seats, governorships, were very far from being Republican routs ..." This show--with, as guests, two of Mr. Buckley's colleagues and one of his nephews--canvasses them all, from Bill Clinton (JB: "Where did the first two years of Bill Clinton's Presidency go? Because by the time we got into the general election we found that 65 per cent of the American people were unaware that Bill Clinton had raised taxes.... A majority of the American people were unaware that he had tried to nationalize the health care of the United States of America") to the Republican leadership in Congress (JO: "Newt is a dashing cavalryman-type leader. He leads people in dramatic enterprises, as a result of which the Republicans won the House in the first place. And because they won the House in the first place, he got in a position to make these other mistakes").
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1378
Program Number S1103, 2614

"The Republican Desolation: Part II"

Guests: Buckley, John. : O'Sullivan, John. : O'Beirne, Kate Walsh.

8 November 1996

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 7
Program details: The title of this show, as WFB explains, "is applicable, of course, only to the presidential race. Other races for Senate seats, House seats, governorships, were very far from being Republican routs ..." This show--with, as guests, two of Mr. Buckley's colleagues and one of his nephews--canvasses them all, from Bill Clinton (JB: "Where did the first two years of Bill Clinton's Presidency go? Because by the time we got into the general election we found that 65 per cent of the American people were unaware that Bill Clinton had raised taxes.... A majority of the American people were unaware that he had tried to nationalize the health care of the United States of America") to the Republican leadership in Congress (JO: "Newt is a dashing cavalryman-type leader. He leads people in dramatic enterprises, as a result of which the Republicans won the House in the first place. And because they won the House in the first place, he got in a position to make these other mistakes").
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1379
Program Number S1104, 2615

"Environment and Health/Safety Issues: Part I"

Guests: Goodman, John C. : Gramm, Wendy Lee. : Wallop, Malcolm. : Pope, Carl. : Linden, Eugene. : Krupp, Fred.

8 October 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 7
Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 3
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 8
Program details: Now that we've conducted a post-mortem of the election, we're back to the environmental series begun in show s01100. Today's sessions, combative but full of substance, focus largely on Superfund, which Mr. Krupp glosses as "the statute that requires that the toxic waste dumps around the country be cleaned up, and it's funded by a tax on industry--the same industries that created the chemicals that ended up in these dumps." But he adds, before his adversaries can do it for him, "The law doesn't work well; it needs to be fixed." One sample: JCG: "I would say that more than half the money spent on Superfund has gone into the hands of lawyers, and I would say that if we abolished Superfund tomorrow we'd probably have a clean environment." WFB: "Or you could abolish lawyers." JCG: "Well, if we could do that we'd also have a cleaner environment."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1374
Program Number S1105, 2616

"Environment and Health/Safety Issues: Part II"

Guests: Goodman, John C. : Gramm, Wendy Lee. : Wallop, Malcolm. : Pope, Carl. : Krupp, Fred.

8 October 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 7
Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 3
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 8
Program details: Now that we've conducted a post-mortem of the election, we're back to the environmental series begun in show s01100. Today's sessions, combative but full of substance, focus largely on Superfund, which Mr. Krupp glosses as "the statute that requires that the toxic waste dumps around the country be cleaned up, and it's funded by a tax on industry--the same industries that created the chemicals that ended up in these dumps." But he adds, before his adversaries can do it for him, "The law doesn't work well; it needs to be fixed." One sample: JCG: "I would say that more than half the money spent on Superfund has gone into the hands of lawyers, and I would say that if we abolished Superfund tomorrow we'd probably have a clean environment." WFB: "Or you could abolish lawyers." JCG: "Well, if we could do that we'd also have a cleaner environment."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1375
Program Number S1106, 2617

"A Look at Pope John Paul II"

Guests: Bernstein, Carl, 1944-

8 November 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 8
Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 4
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 9
Program details: From Deep Throat to the Vatican: Mr. Bernstein's latest book, His Holiness Pope John Paul II and the Hidden History of Our Time, co-authored with Marco Politi, chronicles the secret collaboration between President Reagan and Pope John Paul II. This is a fascinating story, beginning with the first meeting of the President and the Pope in June of 1981, while each was recovering from the assassination attempt on him. As Mr. Bernstein recounts here, "Reagan said to the Pope: 'Look how God has saved us for a special task in the East.' And the Pope agreed." CB: "This Pope, with all his spirituality, with his mysticism and the fact that he wanted to be a barefoot Carmelite monk, nonetheless thinks also in the language of geopolitics. And this is the source of his greatness--the ability to do both."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1377
Program Number S1107, 2618

"The Social Security Debate: Part I"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Goodman, John C. : Peterson, Peter G. : Aaron, Henry J. : Eisner, Robert. : Kuttner, Robert. : Marmor, Theodore R.

4 December 1996

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 5
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 10
Program details: Our guests nobly resist the temptation to behave like, as Governor du Pont puts it, "a bunch of actuaries arguing about an arcane subject." The result fills in some of the gaps left by the formal debate and gives the audience a splendid overview of this crucial topic. Mr. du Pont: "We could all agree in this country that there should be higher education for every American. But nobody thinks that that ought to be confined to a set of government universities. We have government universities; we also have private universities; and you as an individual are free to choose either one. I think the same paradigm is here. Why are we trying to put bells and whistles and strings and glue and Band-Aids on a system in which we insist everyone remain when there's an opportunity to have a mixed system so that a lot of people could do a lot better?" Mr. Kuttner: "...That is what we have. We have Social Security, but then we've got private pension plans, 401Ks, 203Bs, IRAs, Keoghs, and individual mutual funds. And it's the individual-mutual-fund sector that's growing the fastest."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1384
Program Number S1108, 2619

"The Social Security Debate: Part II"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Goodman, John C. : Peterson, Peter G. : Aaron, Henry J. : Eisner, Robert. : Kuttner, Robert. : Marmor, Theodore R.

4 December 1996

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 5
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 10
Program details: Our guests nobly resist the temptation to behave like, as Governor du Pont puts it, "a bunch of actuaries arguing about an arcane subject." The result fills in some of the gaps left by the formal debate and gives the audience a splendid overview of this crucial topic. Mr. du Pont: "We could all agree in this country that there should be higher education for every American. But nobody thinks that that ought to be confined to a set of government universities. We have government universities; we also have private universities; and you as an individual are free to choose either one. I think the same paradigm is here. Why are we trying to put bells and whistles and strings and glue and Band-Aids on a system in which we insist everyone remain when there's an opportunity to have a mixed system so that a lot of people could do a lot better?" Mr. Kuttner: "...That is what we have. We have Social Security, but then we've got private pension plans, 401Ks, 203Bs, IRAs, Keoghs, and individual mutual funds. And it's the individual-mutual-fund sector that's growing the fastest."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1385
Program Number S1109, 2620

"Drugs, Judges, and Justice: Part I: the High Cost of Drug Justice"

Guests: Denman, Delores. : Marvin, Charles. : Toussaint, John Edward. : Puglia, Robert. : Scott, Burton. : Sanders, Alex.

15 November 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 9
Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 11
Program details: Their Honors were gathered in Newport for a judicial conference, and Firing Line took advantage of the fact to ask what the War on Drugs looks like from the bench. The short answer is: a mess. Legislators, as Judge Marvin points out, often pass laws for political motives rather than with a reasoned assessment of their probable results. Tough laws on marijuana, Judge Scott points out, tend to increase the price of the drug, which in turn draws more people into the business of selling. Attempts to impose uniformity of sentencing ignore the possibility, as Judge Puglia points out, "that in a given pair of cases in which the current circumstances are the same, Jim may come before the judge with a lot of baggage that John doesn't have." An engrossing and highly informative trio of sessions.
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1380
Program Number S1110, 2621

"Drugs, Judges, and Justice: Part II: How Should Drug Offenders Be Punished?"

Guests: Denman, Delores. : Marvin, Charles. : Toussaint, John Edward. : Puglia, Robert. : Scott, Burton. : Sanders, Alex.

15 November 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 9
Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 11
Program details: Their Honors were gathered in Newport for a judicial conference, and Firing Line took advantage of the fact to ask what the War on Drugs looks like from the bench. The short answer is: a mess. Legislators, as Judge Marvin points out, often pass laws for political motives rather than with a reasoned assessment of their probable results. Tough laws on marijuana, Judge Scott points out, tend to increase the price of the drug, which in turn draws more people into the business of selling. Attempts to impose uniformity of sentencing ignore the possibility, as Judge Puglia points out, "that in a given pair of cases in which the current circumstances are the same, Jim may come before the judge with a lot of baggage that John doesn't have." An engrossing and highly informative trio of sessions.
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1381
Program Number S1111, 2622

"Drugs, Judges, and Justice: Part III: California and Marijuana--What Now?"

Guests: Denman, Delores. : Marvin, Charles. : Toussaint, John Edward. : Puglia, Robert. : Scott, Burton. : Sanders, Alex.

15 November 1996

Scope and Contents note

Background File: Box/Folder 100 : 9
Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 11
Program details: Their Honors were gathered in Newport for a judicial conference, and Firing Line took advantage of the fact to ask what the War on Drugs looks like from the bench. The short answer is: a mess. Legislators, as Judge Marvin points out, often pass laws for political motives rather than with a reasoned assessment of their probable results. Tough laws on marijuana, Judge Scott points out, tend to increase the price of the drug, which in turn draws more people into the business of selling. Attempts to impose uniformity of sentencing ignore the possibility, as Judge Puglia points out, "that in a given pair of cases in which the current circumstances are the same, Jim may come before the judge with a lot of baggage that John doesn't have." An engrossing and highly informative trio of sessions.
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1382
Program Number S1112, 2623

"Language and Journalism: Part I"

Guests: Kilpatrick, James Jackson, 1920- : Simon, John Ivan.

23 January 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 7
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 12
Program details: Guests and host are not only all formidable wordsmiths, but also professional students of different sorts of writing. This quicksilver conversation lets us in on shop talk at the highest level. JS: "Let's say that Bill Buckley writes a column that only 10 per cent can fully enjoy and fully esteem. All right, so then the other 90 per cent have lots of other stuff that they can read, and I'm sure Bill will manage without those 90 per cent." JJK: "Well, as I said in my affectionate--not hostile--review of your [WFB's] book, I wish you communicated a little lower ... because you have a lot to say, and a great many people who might benefit from your erudition and experience are squeezed out."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1386
Program Number S1113, 2624

"Language and Journalism: Part II"

Guests: Kilpatrick, James Jackson, 1920- : Simon, John Ivan.

23 January 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 7
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 12
Program details: Guests and host are not only all formidable wordsmiths, but also professional students of different sorts of writing. This quicksilver conversation lets us in on shop talk at the highest level. JS: "Let's say that Bill Buckley writes a column that only 10 per cent can fully enjoy and fully esteem. All right, so then the other 90 per cent have lots of other stuff that they can read, and I'm sure Bill will manage without those 90 per cent." JJK: "Well, as I said in my affectionate--not hostile--review of your [WFB's] book, I wish you communicated a little lower ... because you have a lot to say, and a great many people who might benefit from your erudition and experience are squeezed out."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1387
Program Number S1114, 2625

"The Problems of Gay Life"

Guests: Brudnoy, David, 1940- : Huffington, Arianna Stassinopoulos, 1950-

23 January 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 8
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 13
Program details: Mr. Brudnoy, a veteran libertarian journalist (and frequent contributor to National Review), is also a homosexual who, it having become widely known that he had nearly died of complications of AIDS, decided to tell his own story. This conversation candidly engages some painful questions concerning behavior, morality, and perception. DB: "This is, I think, what we can expect in the future: that gradually people will begin to look at what you are and do outside of sex." WFB: "That's silly. Nobody I know says a homosexual can't be a good writer or a good bicyclist or a good anything." DB:"... Trust me, Bill. I guarantee you, many of the people that I experience--not so much nowadays, but early on--really could not imagine that homosexual, as one facet of a lifestyle, and productive doctor or lawyer or whatever ... could be reconciled."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1388
Program Number S1115, 2626

"Marijuana for Medical Use?"

Guests: Califano, Joseph A., Jr.

27 January 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 9
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 13
Program details: California and Arizona had just passed referenda relaxing the laws against prescribing marijuana for medical use--primarily, to alleviate nausea resulting from chemotherapy--a development that Mr. Buckley had long advocated. It is a development that Mr. Califano deplores: "I think [the voters] were sold a bill of goods. I think they were bamboozled." He argues persuasively that the referenda were written much more broadly than proponents portrayed them. WFB argues persuasively against the slippery-slope argument: "Let that person dying of cancer have one whiff of marijuana and everybody's going to die of a morphine fix." You pays your money and you takes your choice--but the two men lay out the choice with crystal clarity.
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1391
Program Number S1116, 2627

"What about Doctor-Assisted Death?"

Guests: Fitzpatrick, Kevin. : Brock, Dan W.

27 January 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 14
Program details: In the age of Kevorkian, the subject of physician-assisted death won't go away. Our guests are almost too far apart to engage each other's arguments. For Father Fitzpatrick (whose doctoral dissertation was on personal autonomy and the right to commit suicide), it matters deeply that, "if physician-assisted suicide were legalized, for the first time in American society, and probably in the West, we will now have private killing authorized by public law." For Dr. Brock, "I think simply that that Christian tradition, powerful though it is, shouldn't be imposed on all of society, because a significant portion of society doesn't accept at least that part of the Christian tradition."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1389
Program Number S1117, 2628

"What about the Libertarian Idea?"

Guests: Murray, Charles A. : Boaz, David, 1953-

27 January 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 11
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 14
Program details: Libertarianism can be hard to pin down--if only because, as Mr. Boaz points out, its adherents, by definition, refuse to toe a party line. In some aspects it is related to, indeed constitutes one strain of, conservatism; in others it approaches anarchism. One sample from this lively conversation: WFB: "I founded a journal, National Review, which I think of as a libertarian journal. Now, a very orthodox challenge was leveled at us by somebody ... who said that we weren't libertarian because we favored pursuing the Cold War.... Now, would that have been a disqualifying characteristic in your judgment...?" CM: "My own opinion is that national defense is one of the legitimate functions of government... And when you have an enemy of the kind we had in the Soviet Union, I think it calls for extraordinary measures...." DB: "Although a strong national defense is essential, I think during the Cold War we sometimes engaged in a national offense [e.g., in Vietnam]."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1390
Program Number S1118, 2629

"What Is the Case for Partial-Birth Abortion?"

Guests: Alvare, Helen. : Ragsdale, Katherine Hancock, 1958-

20 March 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 12
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 15
Program details: Partial-birth abortion had become, and remains, the focal point for public debate-although some people on each side maintain that the technique does not materially affect the ethical question. This show has many fine moments, although each guest seems more concerned to speak to her own gallery than to engage the other's arguments. HA: "No medical doctor has come forward to explain [what]... would lead you to say: 'I'm going to deliver this baby ... except I'm not going to deliver the head, and at that point I will kill the baby.' "... KR: "We would love to see a country where women could afford to have as many children as they wanted, and could afford to bring every pregnancy to term ... But that's not the world we live in."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1397
Program Number S1119, 2630

"Is Newt Permanently Damaged?"

Guests: O'Sullivan, John. : O'Beirne, Kate Walsh. : Ponnuru, Ramesh.

20 March 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 13
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 16
Program details: Newt Gingrich had led the congressional Republicans to triumph in 1994; but then, between the infamous "government shutdown" and ethical questions concerning him personally, he had become seen as damaged goods. Mrs. O'Beirne had been the first to ask publicly whether he shouldn't step down as Speaker of the House. On this show, she and her colleagues give us gloom and doom in the most entertaining way. JO: "Although the Republicans won in '94 and survived to win again in '96, they still have an opposition mentality.... If you're a successful Republican in the House of Representatives, you may get respect there, but the moment you go, say, on the Today show ... you're treated as if you're some kind of weird creature from the black lagoon."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1396
Program Number S1120, 2631

"Rice Students Interrogate William F. Buckley Jr."

Guests: Pierce, Aaron. : Infante, Marcela. : Glassman, Ben. : Iskander, Maryana. : Masters, Ken. : O'Hara, Michelle. : Shorter, Daryl. : Fine, Allison.

14 March 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 14
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 16
Program details: Actually, WFB winds up doing most of the interrogating, since the students, polite and attractive, seem reluctant to take the initiative. One of them, Aaron Pierce, explains the current low level of political activity on the nation's campuses: "Politics is not necessarily seen as something that's going to benefit one as a student; whether you get an A in your calculus class is. So there just isn't the incentive to go out and learn about some of those issues." If he and his colleagues were paying attention, they received from their host a capsule definition of a bedrock principle of political ethics: "I, and most conservatives, believe in the so-called doctrine of subsidiarity. It says anything that can be accomplished in the private sector should be undertaken by the private sector. If you go to the public sector, it should always begin with the lowest feasible political unit, rising to the highest--in this case, the Federal Government--only when the subsidiary units can't."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1393
Program Number S1121

"The Abiding Face of Whittaker Chambers"

Guests: Tanenhaus, Sam.

20 March 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 141 : 15
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 16
Program details: Mr. Buckley had been deeply influenced by Whittaker Chambers, who became a public figure, with the trial of Alger Hiss, just as WFB himself was becoming one, as an undergraduate debater and journalist. Mr. Tanenhaus's new book, WFB tells us, "leaves the reader better informed about America, but also engrossed by high human drama." Much of this comes through in this absorbing half-hour. ST: "Here's a man who many people think lied about everything he ever said. So that forced me as his biographer to check the most minute details. And it turned out Chambers almost never lied about anything. He was more honest than most of us are and had a better memory than most of us do--because he had a better mind."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1395
Program Number S1122, 2633

"A Look at the Astronauts' World"

Guests: Chilton, Kevin. : Jones, Thomas. : Chang-Diaz, Franklin.

14 March 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 17
Program details: The title of this show is perfectly apt: we enter the astronauts' world, from Colonel Chilton's account of what an astronaut does during a two-week stint in the Space Shuttle, to Dr. Jones's view of the importance of Apollo ("it was a way ... to demonstrate as a society that we could do something we set our minds to in direct challenge to the superpower of the Soviet Union"), to the potentialities of Dr. Chang-Diaz's specialty, "magnetically confined high-temperature plasmas." Dr. Chang-Diaz--confirming the statement of an earlier Firing Line guest, astronaut Edgar Mitchell (Firing Line s0279)--also tells us how our space program looks from his native Costa Rica: "I know a lot of other young people all over Latin America that look at NASA as the epitome, the highest thing that humans can do. And I don't know if this is something that is quite tangible in terms of dollars, but it is one of the most beautiful things that goes on in the developing world."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1394
Program Number S1123, 2634

"What Really Happened at The Citadel?"

Guests: Poole, Roger Clifton.

29 April 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 17
Program details: The Supreme Court had ruled that no state could operate a single-sex institution of higher education, and a few young women had, with great fanfare, enrolled at The Citadel, the renowned school in Charleston, S.C., which had been giving young men a military education since before the Civil War. Two of the female cadets had since left the school and, again with great fanfare, filed suit against the school for the hazing they had suffered. General Poole is rather slow speaking, but very moving as a figure trying to steer his beloved institution (he is himself an alumnus) through its current shoals. WFB: "Are you retroactively satisfied that the news of what did happen reached your office expeditiously?" RCP: "No, sir, I am not. I was flabbergasted that I did not know these things were going on."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1398
Program Number S1124, 2635

"The Lucas Case and Private-Property Rights"

Guests: Sanders, Alex. : Robinson, Neil, Jr.

29 April 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 3
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 18
Program details: Mr. David Lucas had purchased two plots of land on an island off shore of Charleston, S.C., in 1992. When he bought them, they were zoned for development; by the time he was ready to build, the law had changed, and so he sued under the Fifth Amendment, charging that the government had taken the use of his land unjustly. A splendid debate on a complex question. NR: "There's a real effort and a movement afoot in this country to take back some of the property rights that have been eroded over several decades of [environmental regulations] that have swung the pendulum so far that people are mad as hell...." AS: "For as long as I have been in this business, which is more than forty years, people have been mad as hell about it. It just depends on whose ox is being gored."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1399
Program Number S1125, 2636

"Is Public Television Still Necessary?"

Guests: Courtney, Beth. : Cauthen, Henry J.

29 April 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 4
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 18
Program details: This show presents an odd social situation, inasmuch as it was Henry Cauthen who first brought Firing Line to public television, where it had been nestling now for 26 years; and yet Mr. Buckley can't suppress his conviction that, really, federally collected tax money oughtn't to be used to fund television shows. A good-tempered, fast-moving debate. BC: "I think that every community deserves a public library, and I think therefore it is important to have public broadcasting." WFB: "Public libraries existed before it ever occurred to anybody that it should be the responsibility of Washington, D.C., to subsidize them. Mr. Carnegie wasn't waiting on Theodore Roosevelt to subsidize a library."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1400
Program Number S1126, 2637

"The Fight against Rent Control"

Guests: Starr, Roger. : Koch, Ed, 1924-

28 May 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 5
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 19
Program details: Rent control was an emergency wartime measure which, with important modifications, was still with us five decades later. Tales of rich people paying $200 a month for seven-room apartments on Central Park West set ordinary New Yorkers' teeth on edge; Mr. Koch famously, while Mayor, refused to give up his rent-controlled apartment in Greenwich Village. Host and guests take us, as lucidly as the subject permits, through issues such as when "luxury decontrol" kicks in (removing controls when a person's income and rent reach a certain level), who may inherit a rent-controlled apartment, and what protections ought to be given the poor--although they don't spell out, for the benefit of non-New Yorkers, points such as the difference between "rent control" and "rent stabilization," and the fact that it is the State legislature, not the City Council, that has authority to change the law. One sample from this spirited exchange: EK: "The poor people, overwhelmingly, are not really concerned [about the possibility of decontrol], because in the areas where poor people live, the rent's not going to go up appreciably, if at all. But on the Upper West Side,... I believe it will go up 100 per cent. And that would remove the middle class from this town, and that would be bad...." RS: "I've been hearing for the last forty years that if we don't do this or don't do that, we're going to lose the middle class. I state the middle class is still here."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1401
Program Number S1127, 2638

"Is the Peace Process in Israel Dead?: Part I"

Guests: Lewis, Anthony, 1927- : Zion, Sidney.

28 May 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 20
Program details: In answer to the title question, the combustible Mr. Zion could only wish it were: "... the whole Oslo accord and Rabin said and Peres said: No Palestinian state. So you see what happens? Now you get more terror, now you have to have a Palestinian state.... Right now they've got enough arms to arm 50,000 people, much of that given to them, in what I consider a great crime, by Shimon Peres. He armed his enemy." To Mr. Lewis and Mrs. Hauser, the issue, as Mr. Lewis phrases it, "is whether there is a better chance for peace with a Palestinian state alongside of Israel, two stable, civil entities, or whether it's better to have Palestinians having to be under the thumb of Israeli armed forces and Israel having the burden of perpetual occupation. That is a recipe for disaster for Israel." No consensus is possible, but the two sides are laid out as clearly as we could wish.
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1402
Program Number S1128, 2639

"Is the Peace Process in Israel Dead?: Part II"

Guests: Lewis, Anthony, 1927- : Zion, Sidney. : Hauser, Rita E.

28 May 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 20
Program details: In answer to the title question, the combustible Mr. Zion could only wish it were: "... the whole Oslo accord and Rabin said and Peres said: No Palestinian state. So you see what happens? Now you get more terror, now you have to have a Palestinian state.... Right now they've got enough arms to arm 50,000 people, much of that given to them, in what I consider a great crime, by Shimon Peres. He armed his enemy." To Mr. Lewis and Mrs. Hauser, the issue, as Mr. Lewis phrases it, "is whether there is a better chance for peace with a Palestinian state alongside of Israel, two stable, civil entities, or whether it's better to have Palestinians having to be under the thumb of Israeli armed forces and Israel having the burden of perpetual occupation. That is a recipe for disaster for Israel." No consensus is possible, but the two sides are laid out as clearly as we could wish.
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1403
Program Number S1129, 2640

"Hong Kong and Mainland China: A View from Taipei"

Guests: Lian, Zhan, 1936-

16 June 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 7
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 21
Program details: On July 1, Hong Kong would be taken over by the People's Republic of China, and it appeared, as Mr. Lien phrases it, "that Peking had been violating the spirit of the law"--that is, their agreement with the British--over certain legislative functions that Hong Kong was supposed to have retained. Furthermore, it had been just a little over a year since Peking had lobbed a few missiles in the direction of Taiwan. Mr. Lien is too prudent to be as informative as he might be (WFB: "Well, I agree with you, but my question is, In the event that Beijing does not live up to these promises, is there any formal way in which you can protest that development? Do you have any sanctions in mind?" LC: "We have not considered that aspect of development yet. But if they do violate their pledge, I think it will have very important chilling implications over the peace and security issues in this area"), but he is an impressive figure, and he does bring us up to date on the Republic of China's solution to the problem posed by the "One China" policy: "We believe that China certainly should be one, but unfortunately it is a divided nation. It is now divided into two political entities. Therefore, as a political sovereign state, the Republic of China on Taiwan is entitled to enjoy a comprehensive system of rights ... befitting any sovereign state in the world."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1410
Program Number S1130, 2701

"Family Reunification and Immigration Policy"

Guests: Beck, Roy Howard. : Stein, Daniel.

28 May 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 8
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 21
Program details: This is not a debate, since Messrs. Beck and Stein both strongly urge controls on immigration, and Mr. Buckley agrees with them much of the way. However, our guests are both deeply knowledgeable and explain clearly how the immigration laws have been changed in recent decades--a matter of which most Americans are unaware. For starters, "family reunification" does not mean just husbands and wives, or parents and minor children: RB: "Most of the people who came in under family reunification last year were the second cousins and third cousins and nieces and nephews and in-laws of people who came in maybe twenty years ago. These are not nuclear families."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1404
Program Number S1131, 2702

"Is NATO Large Enough?"

Guests: Pipes, Richard. : Rodman, Peter W.

16 June 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 9
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 22
Program details: In answer to the title question, which had been absorbing the foreign-policy establishment ever since the breakup of the Soviet Bloc, Mr. Pipes gives a firm "No," Mr. Rodman an equally firm "Yes." The points at issue, which emerge from today's discussion: "Should we bring in the fledgling democracies of the East, such as Poland, the Czech Republic, and Slovenia?" Were we wrong to establish the new Russia-NATO Council (the price exacted for NATO expansion), which could have the effect of weakening NATO as a military alliance? And ever in the background, the fact that, as Mr. Pipes puts it, "The majority of Russian people, when polled, feel nostalgia for Communism, even if they don't want it to come back. But they want an authoritarian government."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1408
Program Number S1132, 2703

"Is Adultery Passe?"

Guests: Rich, Frank. : Maloney, Carolyn.

16 June 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 22
Program details: Whatever the title of this show might lead one to expect, the actual topic has to do with sex in the military. Specifically, with the cases of Lieutenant Kelly Flinn, whom the Air Force had discharged on the grounds of adultery, and General Joseph Ralston, whom it elected not to punish. To Rep. Maloney--as to much of the establishment press--"You can't have one rule for a woman and a different one for a man." To Mr. Buckley, there were far more signal differences than the sex of the officer: Lieutenant Flinn's affairs were with a pilot under her command, and with the husband of a pilot under her command, a clear violation of military discipline; General Ralston's affair was with a civilian. Mr. Rich mostly stays out of the fray, but when he speaks it is to the point: "The whole way Ralston was pilloried through this hotline ... is almost emblematic of how this whole thing has gone astray.... If it hit Ralston this time, it may hit a woman the next time. It seems chaotic to me."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1409
Program Number S1133, 2704

"School Choice/School Vouchers: Part I"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Mansour, Jimmy. : Smith, Bob. : Curry, William E. : Glasser, Ira. : Edley, Christopher F., 1953- : Chase, Bob.

9 June 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 11
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 23
Program details: An informative continuation of the school-choice debate, with the discussion moving from general comments about the public schools to details about charter schools and the different varieties of school-choice proposals. For the proponents of school choice, the important point about our public schools at the end of the 20th century is that they are drastically failing our children. For their opponents, public schools are a symbol and an exemplar of everything that is good about America. As Mr. Curry puts it, "I would argue that if you were to distill the American dream down to a single sentence, it's this: You work hard and play by the rules, and your kid gets a break. And the place where you get that break and the opportunity historically in this country has been in public schools." No consensus is possible, but the discussion reveals a range of visions not only for our schools but for our society as a whole.
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1405
Program Number S1134, 2705

"School Choice/School Vouchers: Part II"

Guests: Du Pont, Pierre S. [Du Pont, Pete; DuPont, Pete] : Mansour, Jimmy. : Curry, William E. : Glasser, Ira. : Edley, Christopher F., 1953- : Chase, Bob.

9 June 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 11
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 24
Program details: An informative continuation of the school-choice debate, with the discussion moving from general comments about the public schools to details about charter schools and the different varieties of school-choice proposals. For the proponents of school choice, the important point about our public schools at the end of the 20th century is that they are drastically failing our children. For their opponents, public schools are a symbol and an exemplar of everything that is good about America. As Mr. Curry puts it, "I would argue that if you were to distill the American dream down to a single sentence, it's this: You work hard and play by the rules, and your kid gets a break. And the place where you get that break and the opportunity historically in this country has been in public schools." No consensus is possible, but the discussion reveals a range of visions not only for our schools but for our society as a whole.
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1406
Program Number S1135, 2706

"Do Unions Have Undue Influence? Part I"

Guests: Williams, Walter. : Jasinowski, Jerry J. : Green, Max. : Shrum, Robert. : Kuttner, Robert. : Becker, George. : Green, Mark J.

17 July 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 12
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 24
Program details: This sometimes heated dispute picks up where we left off in the formal debate, with specific subjects ranging from protectionism to strike-breaking to political contributions. RS: "If you are so insistent on giving labor-union members an opt-out [on their dues being used for political purposes], and they have one, why don't you support the idea that before corporate PACs can give money, they ought to poll their shareholders to see what candidates ought to receive that money?" WFB: "You know what you can do if you don't like the way a corporation is spending your assets? You can sell your share and buy somebody else's share. But you can't do that in a labor union."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1412
Program Number S1136, 2707

"Do Unions Have Undue Influence? Part II"

Guests: Williams, Walter. : Jasinowski, Jerry J. : Green, Max. : Shrum, Robert. : Kuttner, Robert. : Becker, George. : Green, Mark J.

17 July 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 12
Transcript: Box/Folder 188 : 24
Program details: This sometimes heated dispute picks up where we left off in the formal debate, with specific subjects ranging from protectionism to strike-breaking to political contributions. RS: "If you are so insistent on giving labor-union members an opt-out [on their dues being used for political purposes], and they have one, why don't you support the idea that before corporate PACs can give money, they ought to poll their shareholders to see what candidates ought to receive that money?" WFB: "You know what you can do if you don't like the way a corporation is spending your assets? You can sell your share and buy somebody else's share. But you can't do that in a labor union."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1413
Program Number S1137, 2709

"What Is William Weld Up To?"

Guests: Bulger, William M.

20 August 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 13
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 1
Program details: William Weld, the Republican Governor of Massachusetts, had been named Ambassador to Mexico by Democratic President Bill Clinton, but his appointment was being held up by Republican Senator Jesse Helms. Mr. Weld meanwhile--who the year before had failed in his challenge to incumbent Democratic Senator John Kerry--had resigned from the governorship to concentrate on the confirmation hearings. To help sort all this out, we have the retired Democratic boss of the Massachusetts legislature, who in this genial session says of his former enemy turned friend, "I think he is just off on a little bit of a--having fun. He may become the ambassador to Mexico. If he really were intent on being the ambassador, however, I think he'd have sought it from the governor's office in Massachusetts." Mr. Buckley suggests another thing Mr. Weld could have done differently: "My own notion is that Mr. Weld became sort of provocative. He said, along the line: 'Look, I'm drawing a line and you troglodytes over there are different from us types who are sort of airborne Republicans who understand all these niceties.'" And Mr. Bulger adds a salutary warning about our media guardians: "In Massachusetts Helms is only a caricature. We have no idea what he's like. It filters through an exceedingly liberal media up there."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1414
Program Number S1138, 2709

"Nazi Gold and Swiss Banks"

Guests: James, Harold, 1956- : Breindel, Eric, 1955-1998. : Hausfeld, Michael D.

20 August 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 14
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 1
Program details: Even as this story was unfolding it was hard to keep straight all the allegations against Swiss banks being investigated by Al D'Amato's Senate Banking Committee, but basically they come in two categories: helping the Nazis during the war by accepting their deposits of gold (much of it stolen from German Jews), and stonewalling after the war about numbered accounts belonging to Jews. A sometimes abstruse but often moving analysis of what happened and why it still matters. WFB: "Presumably somebody who hasn't checked in on his bank account for fifty years doesn't know it exists, right? Or the children don't know it exists?..." EB: "Well, they did. A lot checked in 1946 and were told that they had to provide death certificates. And you know, to find a death certificate of someone who was gassed is a big trick." ... HJ: "It seems to me not to be a question of indicting a whole society, but to be looking at the way in which ... particular people made decisions--for instance,... the shocking case about the pressure to put the J [for Jude] on German passports, or the decision in August 1942 not to count people who were persecuted for racial reasons as political persecutees. All those have particular people who were responsible for them."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1415
Program Number S1139, 2710

"Revising the Welfare Law"

Guests: Solarz, Stephen J. : Rector, Robert.

20 August 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 15
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 2
Program details: The Welfare Reform Act of 1996 had been regarded, as Mr. Buckley reminds us, "as the principal achievement of Mr. Gingrich's Contract with America," and the Democrats had been looking for a chance to undo it. According to some observers they got that chance in the just-passed budget bill. A major provision of the reform act had been workfare--along lines pioneered by Governor Tommy Thompson in Wisconsin--which Mr. Solarz accurately describes as "a useful vehicle for encouraging people to acquire the skills that enable them to go into the private sector." The budget bill contained a provision mandating the minimum wage for workfare, which, Mr. Rector argues, would put it on an entirely different basis. SS: "My sense is that there is a sufficient national consensus in favor of welfare reform in general and workfare in particular, so that if ... these dire prognostications turn out to be accurate, the Congress will undoubtedly enact legislation making possible a restoration of the workfare program." RR: "They did. They just did. And Clinton promised to veto it."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1416
Program Number S1140, 2711

"Some Problems with Buckley's Christian God"

Guests: Weidhorn, Manfred, 1931-

24 September 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 142 : 16
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 2
Program details: Mr. Buckley's new book, Nearer, My God: An Autobiography of Faith, had caused Mr. Weidhorn to ponder some difficult points in Christian doctrine. The questions he raises are far from new, but it is helpful to hear them articulated by a sympathetic self-described "outsider." MW: "God apparently created the human race knowing that he would damn most of them-because 'strait is the gate,' 'few are chosen'-to eternity. And most people are surely not saints. They cheat on their taxes, they cheat on their spouse, and so on. So they deserve punishment. Would a hundred years in hell suffice? How about a thousand..? But eternity..? There seems to be such a vast disproportion between the crime and the punishment." WFB: "Well, I think I can bring you instant relief on this point, because as far as I know it's only the Calvinists who insist that the overwhelming number of people are doomed to damnation..." MW: "Christianity is above all else a religion of paradoxes. The idea of God dying, and dying by the most humiliating of all punishments...that is such a monumental paradox. It needs dwelling on for the spiritual resonance that it has because it is incomprehensible."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1417
Program Number S1141, 2712

"What's Ahead for the Christian Coalition?"

Guests: Reed, Ralph, 1961-

24 September 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 3
Program details: Mr. Reed had left the Christian Coalition in order to gain greater freedom of movement in advising candidates, but he has no hesitation in speaking about the difficulties his former organization has faced ("I don't think it is just Christianity. I think that secular opinion elites are afraid of ... orthodox faith in all its forms") and its opportunities now that it has passed through "an almost unwritten rite of initiation." But in discussing the future Mr. Reed takes us thoughtfully back into our country's history: "John Adams said that our Constitution was designed for a moral and religious people only and is wholly unsuited for any other. By that he obviously didn't mean that you had to be a member of a particular church to be an American. What he was saying was that in order to have a government limited to certain enumerated purposes ... the only way you could live in such a society without a strong centralized government and have peace and tranquillity was if everybody voluntarily did what was right anyway."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1418
Program Number S1142, 2713

"Should We Strengthen the Marriage Laws?"

Guests: Gallagher, Maggie, 1960- : Ragsdale, Katherine Hancock, 1958-

24 September 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 3
Program details: Louisiana had just passed a two-track marriage law. As Mr. Buckley explains it, "The regular route permits no-fault divorce more or less overnight. The covenant marriage would bind the marriage partners to a five-year moratorium before divorce is effective, and commit the partners to receiving marriage counseling, both before the marriage and after, if dissolution is sought." To Dr. Ragsdale, "I think we should teach people about the difficulty of maintaining true covenanted relationships; we should teach people to expect trouble in their marriages and to work through it.... I don't think that binding someone ever more tightly by the law is the way to accomplish it." To Ms. Gallagher, "Let me tell you what a waiting period can accomplish. First of all the evidence we have suggests that you will save some marriages that could and should be saved. That's the first goal. The second goal is that you shift at least some power and respect into the hand of the spouse that's being left. Right now, we talk about divorce as something that couples do, but in about 80 per cent of cases, it's something that one spouse wants and the other spouse doesn't."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1419
Program Number S1143, 2714

"What Political Issues Concern Students at Ole Miss?"

Guests: O'Shea, Casey. : Stewart, Ashlye. : Morgan, Markeeva. : Chin, Tammy. : Ware, Bruce. : Thigpen, Calvin. : Williford, Cassie. : Sumrall, Timothy.

14 October 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 3
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 4
Program details: The students on this panel--all of them Southern born--are quiet and polite, but they have strong opinions about the question that proves to be the focus of this show, namely, as Mr. Buckley phrases it, "Is there something distinctive that happens in the Southern university experience?" To Ms. Morgan, "We do have a rich culture here, and that makes Southern universities distinct, but what also makes us unique is that they offer the rich culture without sacrificing the academic rigor, and you can't get that anywhere else in the country. It's either one or the other. And we have it all here." To Mr. Thigpen, "I think what makes Southern universities distinctive, maybe,... is the education you get outside of the classroom.... It's not necessarily books, but it's learning how to relate to people, which is probably the most important thing that you face when you leave college, and the most important thing you need to know."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1422
Program Number S1144, 2715

"Is the Cyberworld a Threat?"

Guests: Barksdale, Jim.

14 October 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 4
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 4
Program details: The spiraling use of the Internet was stirring up all sorts of new questions--as our guest puts it, "The Department of Justice is up against areas now, perhaps, where the laws that were written fifty or a hundred years ago are just no longer adequate." His own company was testing, via its lawsuit against Microsoft, how the antitrust laws applied to linked products. And then there was the FBI's demand that encryption be made illegal--or, failing that, that the FBI hold the keys: JB: "There is some question as to the right to hold the keys of private citizens on the presumption that [the FBI] might need them.... I don't think that I, as a private citizen, if I haven't broken any law, am prohibited from having a private conversation with another private citizen without any intervention, court-ordered or not." WFB: "Now wait a minute. You would deny the authority of a court to authorize somebody to open your mail if, let's say, you were a suspected kidnapper?" JB: "No, but I said I was not a suspected kidnapper. You see,... they're presuming guilt because they're taking the key in advance. That's what I'm arguing against...." WFB: "It's on the order of comprehensively opening everybody's mail on the grounds that somebody might be engaged in mischief, instead of showing reasonable cause why this particular letter should be opened."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1420
Program Number S1145, 2716

"The Problems of Privacy"

Guests: Strossen, Nadine.

29 October 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 5
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 5
Program details: Mr. Buckley leads off by pointing out that "There are forty bills introduced in Congress that seek to protect or enhance the privacy of American citizens," some of them having to do with sales of mailing lists and exchanges of medical information, others--prompted by the death of Princess Diana--seeking to rein in aggressive reporters and photographers. Miss Strossen vigorously opposes the latter ("That's very frightening in a free society, Bill. Where do you draw the line between aggressive, investigative reporting? Don't we consider that to be a heroic, essential undertaking in a democracy?") while asserting that "The ACLU proudly defends privacy ... in particular where it is most endangered, and that is, as you alluded to in your opening remarks, not for celebrities, but for the ordinary citizen ... As a result of a little-known bill that Congress passed in 1996, new data banks are being assembled which give us less privacy over our medical records than we have with respect to video rental records."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1423
Program Number S1146, 2717

"Should We Have National Testing?"

Guests: Lemann, Nicholas. : Schaeffer, Bob.

29 October 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 5
Program details: President Clinton had been trying to institute a national test for schoolchildren, to permit, as Mr. Buckley puts it, "interested parties to judge relative progress." Objections had been raised from many points on the political spectrum, and on many grounds (principally interference with local control, and the inherent inadequacy of standardized tests). A high-octane session with two deeply knowledgeable guests. NL: "When ETS [the Educational Testing Service] was founded, the man who was the first president kept a diary.... And one of the things he wrote in his diary right as it was starting was: 'These tests will be for the 20th century what the standard gauge was for railroads in the 19th century.' It's a way of creating--" WFB: "Procrusteanization." NL: "It creates a national market in personnel.... And the other [thing the tests do] ... is being a diagnostic tool to be used to improve education. On the first measure they have worked out fabulously well. On the second measure they haven't worked that well." ... BS: "We already have widely used achievement tests across this country--the Stanfords, the Iowa Test of Basic Skills, the California Achievement Test--which have identified how schools are performing. The task before this nation is not to measure it again, particularly not to measure it with low-level tools, which do dumb down education for everybody, because the schools focus on what they measure, and what you test for is what you get."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1424
Program Number S1147, 2718

"Are There Any Secrets Left?"

Guests: Brent, Jonathan.

29 October 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 7
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 6
Program details: Mr. Brent's undertaking was literally what its title says: the annals of Communism; that is, a selection from 400 million secret documents of the former Soviet Union, to be translated and published in 25 to 50 volumes. The first 5 volumes had by now been published--to a concentrated lack of enthusiasm from the establishment. In this absorbing exchange, Mr. Buckley and his guest explore the possible reasons for this (among them that the establishment didn't want to know that the Communist Party in the United States had been engaged in espionage for the Soviet Union), but some of the most fascinating bits are Mr. Brent's simple description of the difficulties of negotiating the deal ("The Russians ... had no idea what the list price of a book was. They had no idea what a royalty was") or of the physical state of the Soviet archives ("You don't understand. The Russian archives are completely falling apart. They don't have Xerox machines. In the archive of the Red Army, for the chief archivist to turn on the light in her office, she opens the drawer of her desk, she takes out a light bulb, she stands on a chair and screws it in. And on more than one occasion, these archives--imagine, the Red Army archive, the archive of the Central Committee ... --have been closed because they cannot pay their electricity bills or they cannot pay the guard who stands outside with his submachine gun").
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1425
Program Number S1148, 2719

"What Have We Learned about Iraq/Iran?"

Guests: Bill, James A.

12 December 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 8
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 7
Program details: Mr. Bill believes that we have radically mishandled our policy towards Iraq and Iran ever since the Carter Administration. He is not a sparkling speaker, but the information he has to impart has enough intrinsic interest to be well worth listening to. Two samples: "In the international realm, [the Shah] was very shrewd, both in terms of oil politics, as you are talking about, but also in terms of understanding America and understanding Americans. He surrounded himself with individuals that ... could talk baseball with our ambassadors, could talk sailing. He was very, very shrewd. Unfortunately, however, he was not as shrewd with his own people." ... "The sad story of Iraq really began in the early 1980s, whereby the United States began to throw substantial support in the direction of Saddam. In 1972 we took him and his country off our terrorist list. In 1983 we began to share sensitive intelligence information with him. He was involved, of course, in the war with Iran at that time." WFB: "That was a mistake?" JB: "I think it proved to be a great mistake, because we created a Frankenstein. We created our own Frankenstein, who turned on us."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1431
Program Number S1149, 2720

"Are Moral Absolutes Out?"

Guests: Holmes, Paul A. : Ambrosio, Michael P.

4 December 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 9
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 7
Program details: Mr. Buckley sets the stage by quoting, from an article in The Chronicle of Higher Education, instances of moral relativism such as the undergraduate who was appalled by the Holocaust but asked, "Who is to say the Nazis were morally wrong?" This is not the fastest-moving Firing Line, but our guests both have fresh ways of helping us grasp the difference between tolerance and plain sloppiness of thought. PAH: "I remind [my students] that moral relativism is going to play itself out one day. If the statistics about violence are current, it will probably happen in a very dark parking lot... You're going to your car believing that your car is your property and only your property. Well, lurking in the shadows near your car is someone who also has a moral vision, and you've already decided that you are not going to judge it as he cannot judge yours, and yet his moral vision includes the idea that everyone's car is potentially his property."... MPA: "I think the problem, so often, is when we think of this term 'morality' or 'ethics' we think of it as a private matter rather than as a matter of public significance, when indeed the question about morality is about how do we live among others."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1426
Program Number S1150, 2721

"The Evidence of God"

Guests: Glynn, Patrick.

4 December 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 7
Program details: A continuation, with a different interlocutor, of the discussion begun in the latest Firing Line Debate (FLS203). Mr. Glynn's book had stressed the anthropic principle": the idea that it is mind-bogglingly improbable that man just "happened" through natural processes. This show is no sparring match; instead, Mr. Buckley invites Mr. Glynn to lead us through these thickets, which he does with great enthusiasm and clarity: "And scientists ... began to look at the evolution of the universe ... And what they began to do was play with the various values in the universe ... like, you change the value of gravity, or you change the value of electromagnetism, or you change the masses of the subatomic particles. And what they found in these various thought experiments or exercises is that every time they made even a slight change, the whole Big Bang derailed.... And so it began to dawn on scientists that biological life, far from being sort of an accident that just happened ... had to have been programmed into the universe from the very, very start."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1427
Program Number S1151, 2722

"Should America Get Involved with Netanyahu?"

Guests: Zion, Sidney. : Rosenblum, Mark.

13 January 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 11
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 8
Program details: The Middle East was on the front pages again, with heated disputes over how the Oslo Accords should be implemented. "And so," Mr. Buckley begins, "we resume, as alas we may need to do for years ahead, our periodic, worried look at the scene in Israel." Mr. Zion, as we have seen on past Firing Lines, is a passionate defender of Israel no matter what; Mr. Rosenblum believes the Netanyahu government will not keep its part of the bargain without a great deal of pressure. WFB: "Are you saying that in order to appease Saudi Arabia et al. we've got to stay in this act?" MR: "It's not appeasement of Saudi Arabia. There are fundamentalists--politically violent fundamentalist movements--that are alive and well in the region." WFB: "But to appease is not necessarily bad." MR: "No, no, but it's a word like 'pressure' that generally does not resonate in a positive way. So the search for alternative words is important here." SZ: "Well, sure. The word you are doing here is blackmail."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1432
Program Number S1152, 2723

"Abolish All High Schools?"

Guests: Botstein, Leon.

12 December 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 12
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 8
Program details: The problems with American education are a staple of public debate (and of Firing Line programs). Suggested solutions tend towards things like vouchers and charter schools--in order to improve quality by competition--or towards national testing and computers in the classroom. Comes now Leon Botstein (a regular on Firing Line Debates) with a radical proposal: abolish high schools. In this high-energy session--which ranges over the problem of teachers' colleges ("Our teacher training system is the most corrupt, old-fashioned, and useless of any civilized nation") and our "segmented" education system, in which the college professor is seen as doing something radically different from the elementary-school teacher--Mr. Botstein supports his idea brilliantly: "We lose precious time in developing [adolescents'] real passion for learning by a system of education, the high school, which was designed for very big children but is now used with young adults.... In the 19th century people went from home schooling directly to college at 15. This is not a terribly new idea, but there is here now a serious biological basis for it, since probably the age of menstruation has dropped since the mid 19th century to the late 20th century by over three years."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1429
Program Number S1153, 2724

"Overpopulation: A Threat to the Human Spirit and Body"

Guests: Abernethy, Virginia. : Hollingsworth, William G., 1937-

12 December 1997

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 13
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 9
Program details: Some observers (Mr. Buckley cites a recent article by Nicholas Eberstadt) believe that world population growth is on the edge of a drastic--perhaps even dangerous--decline. Our guests don't buy it. WGH: "1950 was when world population finally reached 2.5 billion people. In the fifty years--well, less than fifty years--since then ... world population has grown by almost 3.5 billion. Now that means all of human history and prehistory to 2.5, and then less than fifty years to add 3.5. Now as to the future ... if the median projection proves correct ... in about fifty years or so world population will again add almost 3.5 billion people." Mr. Buckley asks, "Has either of you calculated to what extent is the huge population increase that you've just mentioned owing to longevity?" VA: "Oh, that's a factor, but it's not as large a factor at the older ages as it is because of reduction of infant mortality...." WGH: "But the driving force is fertility." And we're off on an absorbing discussion of the psychology and ethics of Third World population-control programs.
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1430
Program Number S1154, 2725

"Forgiveness for War Criminals?"

Guests: Abram, Morris B.

19 January 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 14
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 9
Program details: "The decision of the Clinton Administration," Mr. Buckley leads off, "is not to instruct NATO troops in Bosnia to round up indicted war criminals and dispatch them to trial by the special court set up by the United Nations." A leading opponent of this decision is Mr. Abram, who first appeared on the public scene as a young prosecutor at the Nuremberg trials, and who brings that perspective to bear in this thoughtful conversation, full of chiaroscuro. MBA: "My question to you is: What is a world to do which knows that about eight thousand people were assembled ... in a safe haven around Srebrenica and were executed? Now we know that, and we know who gave the orders, and they have been indicted.... It's the same question that was put to the Allied powers after World War II. What are you going to do if you catch Hitler, Kaltenbrunner, Himmler, and Ribbentrop and Goering? Churchill said, 'Let's shoot them.' Now that didn't go over with many people." WFB: "He wanted summary justice." MBA: "Yes, sir. Right in the field. Others said, 'Well, we let the Kaiser get away with it, maybe we should let him get away with it.' The decision of the Allied powers, then called United Nations, was to hold trials under the rubric of law and the rule of law."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1435
Program Number S1155, 2726

"Is the Papacy Fading?"

Guests: McBrien, Richard P.

19 January 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 15
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 10
Program details: Father McBrien is a leading liberal Catholic theologian, giving him a very different perspective from that of his host; he is also a serious historian of the Church. This rich discussion situates Pope John Paul II both in the current context and in the light of history. RM: "The powers which the pope had through fully one-half of the history of the Church--that is, the first millennium--were considerably more modest than the powers which the pope accrued ... beginning especially with the papacy of Gregory VII, the end of the 11th century. And I think John Paul II has-- It's almost a climactic moment, his pontificate. He hasn't usurped any power; he is exercising the canonical authority that accrued to the papacy in the second millennium, and he's exercised it more adeptly than any pope before him ... So one should stand back and admire him for using the powers that the canon law of the Church has given him since Gregory VII. But we don't want to say that those are powers which Jesus gave Peter."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1436
Program Number S1156, 2727

"Why Is the Second Amendment So Important?"

Guests: Heston, Charlton.

19 January 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 143 : 16
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 10
Program details: Mr. Heston had recently given a speech at the National Press Club in Washington in which, as Mr. Buckley tells us, "he said not only that he was proud to defend the Second Amendment, but that he thought it the most important of any of the rights guaranteed under the Constitution." Why? Actually, Mr. Heston concedes, the amendments "are all of equal importance. [But] the Second Amendment is the only one equipped to protect and defend the others." A vivid conversation between these two old friends that ranges from the use of guns in resisting tyranny, to the woman needing protection when she comes home late at night from her cleaning job, to this, from Mr. Heston's experience directing a play in China: "Several of my actors were in Tiananmen Square, and ... one of the survivors said, 'You know, as a student of your Constitution and your Bill of Rights, of course freedom of speech is crucial. Freedom of speech doesn't help you much if you're standing in front of a tank.'" WFB: "No. That's eloquently correct. As a matter of fact, not even a pistol would help you very much."CH: "No, not even a pistol. Indeed. A grenade launcher might do the trick."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1437
Program Number S1157, 2728

"Did Camelot Have a Dark Side?"

Guests: Schlesinger, Arthur M. (Arthur Meier), 1917-2007. : Reeves, Thomas C., 1936-

13 January 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 144 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 11
Program details: Seymour Hersh had just published The Dark Side of Camelot, about JFK's private life. On this show a Kennedy loyalist and a former Kennedy loyalist offer a deeply engaging exploration of whether, as their host phrases it, "we are talking about a weakness of character that affected Kennedy's competence or judgment as President of the United States." AS: "The Seymour Hersh book is a really ridiculous book. He is the most gullible investigative reporter, perhaps, in American history. He will believe anything so long as it discredits John Kennedy...." TCR: "I don't want to defend a bad book at great length, but [Seymour Hersh] said he interviewed more than a thousand people. I counted at least 25 of those interviews that are terrific. See, what the audience has to understand is that there has been a concerted effort by the Kennedy family, with the assistance of at least two prominent members of the former Administration, to keep historians from finding out who the Kennedys really were."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1433
Program Number S1158, 2729

"Should We Open Up on Medical Marijuana?"

Guests: Nadelmann, Ethan Avram. : Zimmer, Lynn Etta.

13 January 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 144 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 12
Program details: Since the last time Firing Line discussed marijuana (Firing Line s1115), the California referendum legalizing it for medical use had had conflicting repercussions, with several other states putting similar initiatives on their ballots, but also with California Attorney General Dan Lungren saying that it had opened sales to people with no relevant medical status whatever. Our guests bring fresh perspectives to this often-discussed topic. LZ: "In the effort to discourage recreational use, and in particular to discourage kids from using marijuana, the government and other groups have gone too far and they have described harms of marijuana that in fact are not true ... And I think that's been one of the problems in trying to get the government to take another look at the medical-marijuana issue, that they have gone so far in demonizing marijuana that it's very difficult for them now to pull back..." EN: "More people voted for Proposition 215 in California than voted for either of the presidential candidates. Half of them believe in legalizing marijuana more broadly, the other half don't. But they all agreed that for medical purposes it was a necessity."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1434
Program Number S1159, 2730

"Should Congress Act on the Tobacco Front?"

Guests: McCain, John, 1936-

23 March 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 144 : 3
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 12
Program details: Meanwhile, back to the other stuff you smoke. The previous year some forty state attorneys general had made a pact with the tobacco companies with the aim of reducing tobacco use generally, but particularly among minors, and Senator McCain was pushing for the Federal Government to get more involved. A genial, sometimes enlightening traversal of familiar ground. WFB: "The stimulation of an ethos is a very, very difficult thing to do. Now in my judgment it has substantially succeeded in the matter of tobacco. You go to a reception, a social reception, and practically nobody is smoking--anybody who does smoke is very conspicuous--contrasted with forty years ago, half the people would be smoking...." JM: "But let me point out that you and I go to a reception and nobody's smoking. But if you and I went down to the mall, we'd see a whole lot of teenagers smoking. And that's the problem that I think we're trying to grapple with."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1438
Program Number S1160, 2731

"Is Reform of Social Security in Prospect?"

Guests: Gramm, Phil.

23 March 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 144 : 4
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 12
Program details: A high-energy discussion even though host and guest are in substantial agreement: the energy is generated by the urgency of the problem. One sample from Senator Gramm: "Why are we not moving quicker? I think it's a combination of two things: Number one, politics is principally a ... short-term transaction, and I think that the ability to put this off potentially for another five or six years is appealing to some people. I think, secondly--I'm a conservative and I often get criticized for being doctrinaire. But our biggest problem here is with liberals who are committed to the principle of a government-run, debt-based system. They like the politics of it, they like the social engineering of it, and even though it will fail and even though it will cause taxes to skyrocket and benefits to be slashed, they hate to give it up."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1439
Program Number S1161, 2732

"Do Economics and Morality Have Anything in Common?"

Guests: Kudlow, Lawrence.

7 April 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 144 : 5
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 13
Program details: "Is there a nexus between economic prosperity and moral behavior?" WFB begins by asking. "The broadest view on the subject tells us that societies that are fat and happy tend to let down the moral muscle.... The position is vigorously disputed ... by Lawrence Kudlow," whose latest book was American Abundance: The New Economic and Moral Prosperity. Mr. Buckley presses his guest, a comrade in arms, on some of his historical comparisons. LK: "We have created 36 million jobs since 1982 in this long wave of prosperity that I attribute to Ronald Reagan's launching.... And I think that's why this work ethic and what it teaches, the discipline and restraint, has helped to reduce crime, to reduce welfare, to at least ameliorate some of the pathologies that are so troublesome. It all comes from the workplace." WFB: "The difficulty that I had when I ran into that enthusiasm in your book is that if you look back at American history--where you learn that in the year 1900, 90 per cent of the American people were poor by current standards--if you take that long march towards relative plenty since 1900, you run into pretty odious data: an increase since 1962 of 400 per cent in the crime rate, 320 per cent in illegitimate births, drug consumption, alcoholism ..."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1441
Program Number S1162, 2733

"Do We Need Tariffs?"

Guests: Jasinowski, Jerry J.

7 April 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 144 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 13
Program details: Traditionally, it was manufacturers who pressed for tariffs and other barriers to trade; in recent years, Mr. Jasinowski tells us, "most of them have seen the light, whereas the unions and their friends for reasons that are not altogether clear ... have chosen to protect the status quo." An energetic discussion of the history and theory of free trade, and why we need to do better than 2 1/2 per cent growth. JJJ: "Manufacturers in particular are very pragmatic people. They have to make things and then they have to compete. They have to sell at a profit in competitive markets. And the Japanese threat, which now is almost a joke, scared manufacturers beyond their wits, and they decided that they had to change how they operated, and one of the things they had to do was benchmark on a global basis, and they had to compete on a global basis."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1442
Program Number S1163, 2734

"Is Multiculturalism Still Rabid?"

Guests: Schlesinger, Arthur M. (Arthur Meier), 1917-2007.

7 April 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 144 : 7
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 14
Program details: "In 1991, Arthur Schlesinger wrote a good book," WFB begins provocatively concerning his sometime adversary. But he goes on, "The Disuniting of America began as a long essay and blossomed into a short book, greatly needed and much celebrated, though not by everybody." The book argued that present-day multiculturalism engendered not a tolerance of cultural differences within a whole, but rather a divisive "identity politics." This rich conversation explores how we differ from the English founders of our country, how our attitudes on race have evolved (AS: "[America is] the country that killed red men, enslaved black men, imported yellow and brown men for peon labor. We did it thoughtlessly, without consciousness of what we were doing. The only good Indian is a dead Indian, and so on. Now we've become much more conscious of the fact that, as Paul says, we are all members one of another..."), and how this affects our politics today. WFB: "It seems to me that you worship rather too strenuously at the altar of civil liberties so defined. I don't acknowledge the right of Nazis to march." AS: "I am surprised, Bill, that you deplore liberty." WFB: "In order to maximize liberty, one sometimes has to." AS: "But I think it is dangerous to set precedents which can be used against your own side."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1443
Program Number S1164, 2735

"Would China's Hong Kong Formula Work with Taiwan?"

Guests: Chen, Jianren. : Lord, Winston. : Lilley, James R.

22 May 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 144 : 8
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 14
Program details: The "Hong Kong formula" of the first title refers to the takeover of that former British colony by Peking, but with guarantees of autonomy in certain areas. "Constructive engagement" was a phrase first used by the Reagan Administration with respect to South Africa. A lively pair of shows on diplomacy, arms control, human rights, and more. JL: "President Lee Teng-hui [of Taiwan] had made a trip in 1994 when he went to four countries that recognized [Peking] as the sole legal government of China: Singapore, Indonesia, Thailand, and the Philippines. He met the chief of state in every one of those places: the king of Thailand, the prime minister of Singapore, President Suharto ..., and President Ramos. The Chinese stood by and let it happen. He comes to the United States, he doesn't even meet a janitor in the Federal Government, and they recall the ambassador ... What are we, some sort of fourth-rate banana republic that we get pushed around like this?"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1447
Program Number S1165, 2736

"Does \Constructive Engagement\" with China Endanger Taiwan?""

Guests: Chen, Jianren. [Chen, Chien-jen] : Lord, Winston. : Lilley, James R.

22 May 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 144 : 9
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 15
Program details: The "Hong Kong formula" of the first title refers to the takeover of that former British colony by Peking, but with guarantees of autonomy in certain areas. "Constructive engagement" was a phrase first used by the Reagan Administration with respect to South Africa. A lively pair of shows on diplomacy, arms control, human rights, and more. JL: "President Lee Teng-hui [of Taiwan] had made a trip in 1994 when he went to four countries that recognized [Peking] as the sole legal government of China: Singapore, Indonesia, Thailand, and the Philippines. He met the chief of state in every one of those places: the king of Thailand, the prime minister of Singapore, President Suharto ..., and President Ramos. The Chinese stood by and let it happen. He comes to the United States, he doesn't even meet a janitor in the Federal Government, and they recall the ambassador ... What are we, some sort of fourth-rate banana republic that we get pushed around like this?"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1448
Program Number S1166, 2737

"The Netanyahu Problem"

Guests: Siegman, Henry. : Zion, Sidney.

22 May 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 144 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 15
Program details: The scholarly Mr. Siegman and the explosive Mr. Zion could hardly be more different in manner, but this time--unlike on some of Mr. Zion's earlier Firing Line appearances--the conversation does connect. Consensus is not and could not be reached, but we get a clear idea of the opposing positions on Prime Minister Netanyahu's rejection of certain Clinton Administration proposals. HS: "Netanyahu is incapable of making decisions, and whatever his long-range strategic vision may be, assuming he has one, it is something that he treats in eschatological terms. In terms of the immediate realities, his goal is to delay decisions and keep delaying them, and allow the status quo to prevail." ... SZ: "Bibi Netanyahu got elected not because he was against the peace process, but because he was going to insist that it was a bilateral agreement and that they had to do what they promised.... If he had been against the peace he would never have been elected."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1449
Program Number S1167

"Does the Fourteenth Amendment Have a New Meaning?"

Guests: Graglia, Lino A. : Strossen, Nadine. : Lynn, Barry W.

4 May 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 144 : 11
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 16
Program details: For several years (starting in 1992, with shows s0952-s0953), Firing Line had made a practice of inviting all the participants in a debate to return for a free-form discussion of the same topic. Those shows were fun but hectic, with seven or eight people clamoring for attention. This new format allows for real discussion, and this one proves enlightening, even if none of the participants' minds was changed. LG: "Nearly every change in the domestic social policy in the last forty years has, amazingly, come not from legislatures but from the Supreme Court. We have basic questions of criminal procedure, prayer in the schools, and so on that have been decided by the Supreme Court. Now how has that happened? Well, they're interpreting the Constitution. . . . And virtually all of these decisions . . . involve or purport to involve a single constitutional provision, the Fourteenth Amendment." . . . NS: "Barry Lynn mentioned our victory in having the Supreme Court. . . strike down Congress's attempt to regulate the Internet, but at the very same time, not only states but local library boards and local school boards were busy enacting their own restrictions on the Internet. Now that is a particularly dramatic example, because given the global nature of this medium, what's done in one local district, one state, can affect censorship and free speech not only for everybody in that local community, but indeed in the entire United States and even worldwide."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1444
Program Number S1168, 2801

"The Sexual Harassment Mess"

Guests: Graglia, Lino A. : Strossen, Nadine. : Botstein, Leon.

4 May 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 144 : 12
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 16
Program details: The Paula Jones case had put sexual harassment on the front pages and our guests in this second follow-up to the ACLU debate have a spirited exchange on the specific and the general question. Two samples: LB: "Since we work so much as Americans and the workplace is a large part of our lives and sexuality is clearly a central part of our lives no one tells the truth about their sex life anyway so in reality what goes on in the world has always remained private. And is the government--are we going to start to legislate by law what we deem to be proper sexual behavior?"... LG: "The question of what constitutes a harassment case is very much up in the air but I would tend to think that no matter what constituted it dropping your pants and asking to be serviced should constitute it."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1445
Program Number S1169, 2802

"Judge Bork's Case against Microsoft"

Guests: Bork, Robert H.

4 June 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 144 : 13
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 17
Program details: "There was some bewilderment in the legal and journalistic community," Mr. Buckley begins, "when it was learned that the eminent Robert Bork would actively side with the suitors who were banging on the door of the Department of Justice asking for antitrust action against Microsoft. The reason for the surprise is that Judge Bork is associated with the school that asks for minimum federal activity in the antitrust theater." His Honor leads us pellucidly through both the legal and the technological reasons for his stance: "Most of the people they [Microsoft] deal with are not allowed to mention Netscape to a customer.... They have a whole list of such agreements which do not create efficiency that's beneficial to consumers but only stifle competition." ... "The Department of Justice has indicted or sued people for being successful. And the Supreme Court, in the days of the Warren Court, upheld those cases against successful people. I think no defendant ever won a case in the Warren Court. But the Department of Justice is not that way now, and I know the current assistant attorney general in charge of the antitrust division. He is very bright and very cautious and believes in the free market. He is not out there punishing somebody just because he doesn't like success."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1450
Program Number S1170, 2803

"With All the Cures, What Will We Die From?"

Guests: Nuland, Sherwin B.

4 June 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 144 : 14
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 17
Program details: Although the topic is grim, the discussion of what doctors can now do and how much they should do is exhilarating. WFB: "I think what you've bumped into is the problem of seeming to object to the aesthetic dimension of human relations. I never want my wife to stop using lipstick. My mother, who died at 89, used lipstick till the last day, and it would have horrified me as a form of spiritual capitulation if she'd stopped doing so.... Now I don't see why a reasonable analogy of that wouldn't be popping a pill if you're going bald, simply on the grounds that it's not much trouble to pop a pill, but people kind of look nice with hair on." ... SN: "We now have a great deal of evidence indicating that more than 50 per cent of the time, the living will is ignored in intensive-care units in teaching hospitals ... Young doctors are spitfire pilots. And when you're in an intensive-care unit, although most people don't realize it, your care is being supervised by people who are on average age 40 and below--the most exciting time of a career from the point of view of solving the riddle of diagnosis and therapy."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1451
Program Number S1171, 2804

"Should They Go to College if They Can't Read or Write?"

Guests: Badillo, Herman, 1929- : Sullivan, Edward C. (Edward Christian), 1933-

4 June 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 145 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 18
Program details: In 1969, under John Lindsay, New York City instituted "open admissions," meaning that anyone who graduated from high school could enroll in a college of the CUNY system. Since this coincided with a drastic decline in the City's elementary and secondary public schools, the result was a number of freshmen who, as WFB puts it, "couldn't read or write well enough to profit from higher education" (see Firing Lines s0277 and s01039). Comes now Herman Badillo--a veteran New York politico, born in Puerto Rico but educated in New York City (before the decline)--with a resolution to end open admissions. His main opponent is Mr. Sullivan, Chairman of the Assembly's Committee on Higher Education, and they have at it here, civilly but passionately. ECS: "One of the things Mr. Badillo has done ... is to try to denigrate a degree from City University. Did you know that John Jay College, which specializes in criminal justice, was voted by the peers around the country as the finest college in criminal justice in the United States? Harvard was second...." HB: "But let me give you another figure which is very depressing. ... At City College, which was the flagship institution, over 60 per cent of the students who get a bachelor's degree or a master's degree in education to be teachers, they get a degree and they cannot pass the teacher's exam."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1452
Program Number S1172

"Goldwater Revisited [memorial tribute]"

Guests:

9 July 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 145 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 19
Program details: This is the fifth time Firing Line has offered a memorial tribute to a favorite guest (the others being Allard Lowenstein, Clare Boothe Luce, Michael Harrington, and Malcolm Muggeridge). Senator Goldwater had died on May 29, at the age of 89, in his beloved Phoenix. Before showing clips from the two shows taped at his home there in 1993, Mr. Buckley recalls his old friend and comrade in arms: "He was a considerable figure in America. A presidential candidate, of course, but a figure who, by espousing so forcefully conservative ideas, gave political America the sense that we hadn't been entirely drowned by the New Deal. And, of course, Goldwater was unremitting in his opposition to Communism, whose defeat he lived to see. ... He was several times on Firing Line [starting in its first year of existence, with show 016], and we take leave of him here, sadly and gratefully."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1453
Program Number S1173, 2806

"More/Less Trade with Asia?"

Guests: Browning, Peter. : Jasinowski, Jerry J.

20 July 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 145 : 3
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 19
Program details: This good-natured and highly informative session, more a seminar than a debate, is partly about how much trade we might ideally want, but more about how the Asian economic meltdown affects how much trade those countries can manage. JJJ: "If you look at the situation 15 years ago, the American industrial system was supposed to be buried by the Japanese, and now the tables are completely reversed, and it all has to do with innovation and change in America. That's why we were able to come back.... I think that Japanese culture has great difficulty making big changes, and that's why I continue to be a little pessimistic that even as you look forward into '99, we may not get a Japanese economy that's strong enough...." PB: "What I would like to see in Japan is them being able to sit down politically and come to grips with the necessity of dealing with bankruptcies, dealing with the real-estate bubble, having to write off difficult loans ... It's interesting--there has been more investment gone into China in the last twenty years than has gone into Japan in the last forty years."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1459
Program Number S1174, 2807

"Looking Back on Bosnia"

Guests: Holbrooke, Richard C.

9 July 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 145 : 4
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 19
Program details: "Bosnia" in this show's title is a synecdoche for the whole explosive region of the Balkans, of which Kosovo was currently the likeliest to erupt. An absorbing session with a man who, whether or not conservatives will always agree with him, gives a vivid account of how the world let this mess get as bad as it is, and what we might still do to retrieve the situation. RH: "Negotiating things like this really makes you pleased about America. We were in Dayton, and Dayton is in Ohio, and Ohio has more of the people from this area [the Balkans] than any other state in the Union. We were picketed by Albanian-Americans; Croats and Serbs came to us; the governor of Ohio was Serbian-American; John Kasich is Croat-American, the powerful Republican congressman; the publisher of the Cleveland Plain Dealer is Serbian-American. I kept saying to all the people at Dayton, 'Look, in Ohio they restrict their rivalry to softball games and an occasional barroom fight. Why can't you do the same thing in your own area?' " WFB: "I can't imagine saying that to Milosevic." RH: "Oh, I did."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1454
Program Number S1175, 2808

"Were Chinese Dissenters Satisfied with Clinton?"

Guests: Wu, Hongda Harry.

9 July 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 145 : 5
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 20
Program details: "Harry Wu," Mr. Buckley begins, "is in a serious sense to be compared with Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn." As a young man he had criticized Communism during the short-lived Hundred Flowers Campaign, for which offense he was sent to Laogai (the Chinese equivalent of Gulag); as the winds of change blew through China in 1979, following Mao's death, he was released and was allowed to emigrate to the United States. In 1995 he was arrested trying to re-enter China in order to document his assertions about Laogai. This time he was expelled from the country instead of being sent back to the camps where he had spent 19 years. His English is somewhat halting, but his mere presence is a tremendous witness to the human spirit, and he gives trenchant advice about how the United States can help the cause of freedom: "China today is on a crossroads of the history. This is very good opportunity for Chinese and American and the people of the world. Give a little bit of push and the Communist regime will disappear from China. ... You mentioned a student personal exchange. Very good program. Radio Free Asia: very good program. But you know, Chinese did not accept the reporters from Radio Free Asia, denied their visas. If America says, 'If you deny their visas I will deny your visa and I will cancel some of the economic contracts,' that is some real thing in the constructive-engagement policy."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1455
Program Number S1176, 2809

"The U.S. Worker and Free Trade"

Guests: Browning, Peter. : Jasinowski, Jerry J.

20 July 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 145 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 20
Program details: A second discussion of trade issues with Messrs. Browning and Jasinowski (see Firing Line s1173). The first half-hour focused on the implications of, as WFB puts it, "the wounded Asian world." This session comes back home and looks at the American worker--and, in terms of training, our guests don't like what they see. But they are not prepared to give up, and this show is ultimately quite encouraging. PB: "Now, before individuals can get in the available pool to join the [Sonoco] plant, we're asking them to go over to the local community college to be trained there and tested and evaluated to see if they've got the requisite skills; also to help them get those skills." ... JJJ: "We have to ... move people up to a whole higher level of skills. It's not just basic mathematics and basic reading. It's also computer skills. It's a new critical facility. If we're going to continue to increase productivity, you have to have people trained much better than what we have historically had in manufacturing."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1457
Program Number S1177, 2810

"Did McNamara Tell the Whole Story?"

Guests: McMaster, H. R., 1962-

9 July 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 145 : 7
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 21
Program details: Major McMaster, who has taught history at West Point and who commanded a cavalry regiment in combat in the Persian Gulf War, challenges, as WFB puts it, "all the assumptions about the Vietnam War that we tend to cling to, both those who approved the war and those who did not." As a talk-show guest, the Major suffers from a desire to impart all he knows about the subject in half an hour; but what we do learn should send us to his book to learn more. HRM: "One of the elements of the conventional wisdom in connection with Vietnam is that Vietnam was a quagmire that sucked an unwitting American Government into a war that it fundamentally did not understand. What this new evidence suggests--most of it recently declassified documents of the most confidential meetings between the President and his closest advisors, and tapes of telephone conversations, for example, between Lyndon Johnson and his closest advisors and confidants--[is] that these were men who not only should have known better, but who did know better and who made these decisions anyway."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1456
Program Number S1178, 2811

"On Impeachability"

Guests: Coulter, Ann H.

18 September 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 145 : 8
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 21
Program details: After the exploration of President Johnson's lies with Major McMaster (above), we get an exploration of President Clinton's very different lies with Ms. Coulter. There is some serious discussion of what James Madison and his colleagues meant by "high crimes and misdemeanors" and what impeachment of a President would mean to the nation; but there is also a great deal of unbridled contempt for William Jefferson Clinton. AC: "We already know he's a pervert, he's a creep, he's a liar, he obstructs justice. He appears to actually be a criminal. And it is going to bring him down in our esteem that Congress finally gets around to saying, 'Oh, and we censure you'? ... A solemn censure of, say, President Carter or President Reagan would have been a stigma because that would have been the worst thing you could say about either of them. But you are already talking about a man who has absolutely no reputation, no shame, no dignity."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1460
Program Number S1179, 2812

"The Memory of Hong Kong"

Guests: Patten, Chris, 1944-

18 September 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 145 : 9
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 22
Program details: In electing--over protests worldwide--to turn Hong Kong over to a China radically different from the one with which the century-old lease had been signed, the Thatcher government did negotiate certain protections. Mrs. Thatcher's successor, John Major, sent Christopher Patten to Hong Kong to implement the transition, and, as Mr. Buckley puts it, "Acting with strict accordance to the letter of the law on the final agreement between London and Beijing, he jump-started self-rule." We get a taste here of how he managed it, as he speaks trenchantly and engagingly of freedom and totalitarianism east of Suez. CP: "I did have the license to say to my colleagues in London and to people in Hong Kong, 'Look, when we talk about things like the rule of law, when we talk about civil liberties, when we talk about elections, we mean the real thing, not how China may redefine these things.' In relation to elections, for example, I am often embarrassed by the modesty of what I tried to do and say, which provoked this astonishing reaction from China.... I recall one leading China advisor saying: 'Governor Patten doesn't understand the Chinese. They don't want to rig the elections, they just want to know the results in advance.'"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1461
Program Number S1180, 2813

"The Coming Elections"

Guests: Green, Mark J. : Fund, John H., 1957-

13 October 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 145 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 22
Program details: What would happen in the elections three weeks hence? Both teams had seen their leaders wounded--Newt Gingrich by the 1995 "government shutdown" (a political disaster, though nothing much happened to the government itself) and then by allegations of personal financial misdoings; Bill Clinton by Monica Lewinsky and Paula Jones and all the rest. Each team had a trend in its favor--for the Democrats, the fact that the Republicans had already, in 1996, fallen back from their stunning victory in 1994; for the Republicans, the fact that the party in control of the White House normally suffers in the off-year election. Mr. Fund is a conservative Republican, Mr. Green a liberal Democrat, and Mr. Buckley starts by requesting "that they attempt to give opinions as objective as they can manage, even if to do so gives aid and comfort to the enemy." Mr. Green starts by conceding that "When Bill Clinton first got elected, the Democrats had a majority in the Senate, the House, the governors' mansions, and the Democrats have lost all three," and we're off on a pungent exchange ranging from the tobacco companies to school vouchers to what Mr. Fund describes as "the memo written by Hillary Rodham, who I think laid out the constitutional basis for impeachment." (It was written in 1974, about another President--but... )
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1463
Program Number S1181, 2814

"Is There a Moral Point before the House?"

Guests: Leo, John. : Podhoretz, John.

13 October 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 145 : 11
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 23
Program details: An often delightful discussion of a repellent topic: President Clinton's misdoings. JL: "Well, I think the lies are the central part of it.... The suborning of perjury, the perjury, the inducing of Madeleine Albright... to lie, getting his lawyers to lie. I think this is a huge bit of wreckage that the President has presented us with, and to peel it all back and say, 'Would we feel the same way about a consensual adulterous affair?' I think, is too hypothetical." ... JP: "What we have here ... is a story not just of immoral sexual conduct, but a rather grotesque betrayal play in which every character in this drama, theoretically, is betraying someone else. Clinton is betraying his wife; he is betraying his mistress, Ms. Lewinsky, by essentially throwing her to the dogs, encouraging her ... to lie in the Paula Jones deposition, thus placing her at great risk of jail. She herself is then betrayed by her friend Linda Tripp, who is taping her ..."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1464
Program Number S1182, 2815

"Is There a Role for the CIA?"

Guests: Schlesinger, James R.

13 October 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 145 : 12
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 23
Program details: The CIA had taken a beating from the press and Congress in the Seventies; it had been plagued by double agents, including, spectacularly, Aldrich Ames. Was there still a point to it? Mr. Schlesinger calmly and convincingly tells us why there is, and how some people got the idea that there wasn't. JRS: "Everything that the agency has done over the years has been authorized by the political authorities. A lot of people don't like what the political authorities have authorized, [but]... they criticized the agent rather than those who did it. When the Kennedy brothers were interested in disposing of Mr. Castro, for example, when these issues surfaced, they surfaced less as a criticism of President Kennedy or his brother the Attorney General than it was a criticism of the agency--for doing what the President of the United States through the National Security Council had authorized." WFB: "So, in other words, the idea that a headstrong agency simply went to Chile or Guatemala and said, 'It would be fun to throw the government over'--that's just anti-CIA cant? ..." JRS: "It's not necessarily anti-CIA cant, it's simply ignorance."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1465
Program Number S1183, 2816

"Looking Back on Vatican II"

Guests: McBrien, Richard P. : McInerny, Ralph.

18 September 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 145 : 13
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 24
Program details: These two Notre Dame professors--Father McBrien a noted theological liberal, Mr. McInerny a noted theological conservative--are old antagonists, and the exchanges are sometimes heated. But even if they sometimes forget that they are speaking to a lay audience, we get a good sense of how the Catholic Church promulgates--and argues about--its doctrines. Father McBrien: "In my course--and I teach over a hundred students every year-I never once would get up and say the Pope is wrong about birth control." Mr. Mclnerny: "Are you saying it now?" Father McBrien: "No, I'm just-I disagree with the teaching on birth control." Mr. Mclnerny: "Why? Because he's wrong..?" Father McBrien: "We shouldn't let the leaders off scot-free-not just popes, but also bishops... How effectively are they teaching? Why is there such a wide disconnect from so many people..?" Mr. Mclnerny: "I find the present Pope to be a magnificent teacher, and it seems to me when he does speak, people understand him very easily and follow him... When he came on his first visit [to America] it was a magnificent occasion... Immediately after he left there were people who were undercutting what he said and saying, 'Well, he doesn't understand the United States...' So the impact of the man, it seems to me, is sapped right at the roots."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1462
Program Number S1184, 2817

"What Happened to the Republicans?"

Guests: Regan, Edward V. : Fund, John H., 1957-

12 November 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 145 : 14
Transcript: Box/Folder 189 : 24
Program details: Viewed strictly by the numbers, the election had not been so bad for the Republicans: they held their majorities in both House and Senate (although their House majority dropped from 11 seats to 6 seats), and they lost only one governorship. But they had been expecting great gains from the Clinton scandals. In helping us sort it all out, our guests are entertainingly gloomy. WFB: "How possible is it in an age of television and radio for an individual running for state office or federal office to make his own points clear to his constituency? ..." ER: "Oh, I think it's very possible.... And I have had plenty of experience. People would listen to a candidate for state comptroller or a candidate for Buffalo councilman more than they would listen to a congressman or a senator. People believe in their state and local government."... JF: "During the 1974 Nixon debacle there were a hundred polls on the subject. There were five hundred this year.... A politician is scared of his own shadow unless he has a poll and a focus group in both hands."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1466
Program Number S1185, 2818

"Do We Need Laws That Confront Hate Crimes?"

Guests: Strossen, Nadine. : Jeffrey, Terence.

12 November 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 145 : 15
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 1
Program details: "After the black American in Texas was mutilated and killed," Mr. Buckley begins, "and the gay student in Wyoming also mutilated and killed, President Clinton asked for increased federal dominion over hate crimes. Is there a need, let alone a philosophical justification, for such a thing, or was Mr. Clinton's call nothing more than what George Will designated as moral pork barrel?" A crackling exchange over the conflicting legal principles. WFB: "John hits this passerby, who's black, and steals his wallet. Now, if he is convicted merely of stealing, he gets five years, let's say. But if he is convicted of hitting him because he's black, he gets ten years. Now why would that one sentiment, i.e., prejudice, be more greatly penalized than the kind of cupidity that brings on mugging and stealing?" NS: "Well, for the same reason that our civil-rights laws have taken acts that are completely lawful in general-- We have a employment-at-will doctrine in this society, which basically means an employer can refuse to hire somebody or can fire somebody for any reason at all, except... [that] you may not refuse to hire, you may not fire, because of these invidious classifications: race, gender ... So, if you take something that is already a crime, it is completely fair and rational for society to say, 'This is a more serious crime, given the problems of discrimination.'"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1467
Program Number S1186, 2819

"Can Just Everyone Understand Modern Art?"

Guests: Safer, Morley.

12 November 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 1
Program details: WFB begins cautiously: "Vincent van Gogh sold one painting before committing suicide at age 37. His paintings now sell for $10 million minimum. Igor Stravinsky noted in his autobiography that it takes, as a rule, fifty years for the listening public to catch on to what a composer is up to. Taking all that into consideration ... are we being hornswoggled?" And we're off on a delicious romp through the world of modern art, starting with a photograph of Pristine Vacuum Cleaner by Jeff Koons, which Mr. Buckley asks his guest to describe. MS: "That is something called a Shop-Vac, which I am sure many viewers have in their garage as we speak. That happens to be a new, virginal Shop-Vac. Never been used. I can't remember the precise price. I think it was $500,000 or $600,000... Now what makes it different from your Shop-Vac? Nothing. Nothing. Nothing at all other than that it has been declared a piece of art by Mr. Koons, and certainly by Mr. Koons's dealers, and, more remarkably, by some of the most distinguished critics."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1468
Program Number S1187, 2820

"The GOP and the Hispanic Vote"

Guests: Garza, Tony.

3 December 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 2
Program details: Mr. Garza, a Mexican-American from the border town of Brownsville, Texas, had been appointed Secretary of State in 1995 by newly elected Governor George W. Bush; in November he had been elected in his own right to one of the top posts in Texas government. A low-key but very informative look at Mr. Bush in particular and ethnic politics in general. TG: "What Bush did through his term was to say, 'Listen, we're going to enforce these [immigration] laws. We're going to enforce them in a respectful way, but a country has a right to enforce its borders.'..." WFB: "What were the Democrats saying at the same time?" TG: "Well, the national Democrat, I think, was trying to use it as an issue that separated Hispanics from the positions Republicans were taking. What is somewhat offensive is that it suggests that there are no distinctions between Hispanic-Americans--Mexican-Americans--and people who don't share the rights that accrue to citizens."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1469
Program Number S1188

"Is Texas Permanently Republican?"

Guests: Barnes, Ben F., 1938-

3 December 1998

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 3
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 2
Program details: To the title question, Mr. Barnes gives a resounding "No:" "I don't think Texas has undergone a major political shift in the last twenty years, Mr. Buckley. I think the recent victory in November was a George W. Bush victory." In fact, the show winds up being largely an encomium to Mr. Bush that conservatives will find both heartening and disturbing: "The first thing that Governor Bush did when he was elected four years ago, he embraced the Democratic Lieutenant Governor, Bob Bullock, and the Speaker of the House, Pete Laney, and put his arms around both of those very powerful men in Texas government and stayed there throughout the entire session. ... He was a very good bi-partisan governor during the past four years. ... I don't think Republicans run government as well as the Democrats do. And I think George Bush perhaps could change that, because he's not going to be as far to the right and as anti-government as some of the other Republican candidates."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1470
Program Number S1189, 2822

"Is New York City Out from Under?"

Guests: Giuliani, Rudolph W.

13 January 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 4
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 3
Program details: It was thirty years ago, Mr. Buckley reminds us, that "Theodore White wrote his famous essay in which he concluded that New York was ungovernable." That was midway through John Lindsay's time in office, and Mr. Lindsay and his successor, Abe Beame, did their best to prove Mr. White correct. Then Ed Koch took over, followed by Rudy Giuliani (with one term of David Dinkins in between as a salutary warning), and things were looking up--in fiscal terms, in terms of crime, and in terms of esprit de corps. Mayor Giuliani begins, in his hard-edged way, with a provocative sidelight on why Republicans are doing so well as mayors (of Los Angeles and Indianapolis, among other cities): "You're free of all of those special-interest groups that [machine politicians] have to give a piece of [their] agenda away to. So that if you can get...elected, you can actually accomplish something that's different than what has been going on for the last forty or fifty years." Then on to marijuana, President Clinton, and much else.
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1475
Program Number S1190, 2823

"What to Do about Pinochet?"

Guests: Decter, Midge. : Roth, Kenneth.

12 January 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 5
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 3
Program details: In 1990 Augusto Pinochet had stepped down as President of Chile, having held power ever since the coup against the Marxist Salvador Allende in 1973. In 1998, while visiting London, he was arrested pursuant, as Mr. Buckley phrases it, "to a motion by a Spanish judge to extradite him to answer to crimes against humanity." The world community had mobilized, and we hear today from eloquent spokesmen for the two sides. MD: "Does that not leave you sleepless at night? That theory of justice, that any country in any jurisdiction is competent to do this?" KR: "Well, what would leave me sleepless is...Let's imagine that Hitler lived and decided to start traveling in the south of France, the Italian Riviera, and these courts, these nations, could do nothing to arrest him because this theory of universal jurisdiction would not be accepted by you..." MD: "We're not just legally arguing here. We're talking about someone who did (a) make life for the population in his country very much better, (b) step down and leave it a democracy." KR: "Yes, indeed, Chile has emerged from the Pinochet era with a vibrant economy. Mussolini made the trains run on time."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1474
Program Number S1191, 2824

"Israeli Logjam: What Now?"

Guests: Hauser, Rita E. : Zion, Sidney.

19 January 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 4
Program details: The "logjam" of this show's title has to do with the collapse of the Wye Accords between Prime Minister Netanyahu and Palestinian leader Arafat, under the aegis of President Clinton. These two guests have gone at it before on Firing Line, and Mr. Buckley, as referee, keeps them down to a dull roar. SZ: "Bibi [Netanyahu] got elected not to destroy the peace process but in order to make it work, but he has done that. Every pullback that he was supposed to do was all conditioned on [the Palestinians] doing what they said they would do. But it's not looked at that way from the State Department or the White House...." RH: "The problem with Bibi was that he was unable to keep all the promises he made, because every day he made different promises. He made promises to the United States, he made promises to the Palestinians, he made promises to the Israeli people and then promises to his coalition partners, who were made up largely of right-wing and nationalist forces." WFB: "And they were mutually incompatible?" RH: "They were all incompatible, and finally it blew up."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1480
Program Number S1192, 2825

"What Does the Clinton Crisis Tell Us about the Mood of America?"

Guests: Forbes, Steve, 1947-

13 January 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 7
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 4
Program details: Mr. Buckley says of his guest, "He is, of course, an object of curiosity as the wealthy and well-educated young man who wants to be President of the United States. That happens to be okay by me because we believe the same things." Host and guest start with President Clinton and, as Mr. Forbes puts it, "his abusing the power of the Presidency to destroy other people, their reputations, for the mistakes he made." But they soon get onto the substance of Mr. Forbes's campaign. WFB: "You're making it sound as though Americans were poor. That isn't correct, is it?" SF: "We're doing well compared to other countries.... We have a very strong economy; the fundamentals are very strong. But it's like Michael Jordan when he's playing basketball. The best player ever. He would play well even if you put a pack on his back with fifty pounds of weights in it, but he wouldn't play as well as if you took that pack off his back. The tax burden on the American people is growing. So yes, we're a rich country, but... things are starting to happen that are going to undermine the prosperity."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1476
Program Number S1193, 2826

"Can We Afford a Missile Defense?"

Guests: Gaffney, Frank J., Jr.

13 January 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 8
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 5
Program details: There had been talk again of missile defense, and our guest--one of the leading students of the matter in the West--argues passionately and cogently that we can and must go ahead. FJG: "[President Clinton] wants desperately to preserve this ABM Treaty. It is regarded by him and his collaborators as the cornerstone of strategic stability and the basis for U.S.-Russian relations." WFB: "Why?" FJG: "I think principally because many of them--the Strobe Talbotts, of the world, for example,... the Leon Feurths, the Al Gores, the people around the President--have invested their entire professional lives on the notion that you can modulate the U.S.-Soviet, now Russian, relationship through arms control and that at the center is this treaty that--incredible as it may seem--reduced to its essence says: 'We will leave our people absolutely vulnerable to any kind of attack if the Russians will leave their people vulnerable.'"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1477
Program Number S1194, 2827

"Tom Wolfe and His Critics"

Guests: Wolfe, Tom.

19 January 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 9
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 5
Program details: This favorite Firing Line guest, with his white suits and his rapid-fire delivery, had just published his first novel in 11 years, to significant but not universal acclaim. But let's let him tell it: "It was not only Norman Mailer but also John Updike rushed into print. These old men--and since I am about their age I can call them that--these old men who should be reserving their strength, conserving their energy, suddenly had to rise up from off of their pallets and try to shoot this book down. I think it was because I had predicted in 1973 ... that the future of the American novel, if it was to have a future, was in a highly detailed realism achievable only by reporting along the lines of what Zola meant when he talked of naturalism.... Suddenly this book... cast a shadow in the minds of people like Mailer and Updike, and they suddenly found themselves in the dark. Because if this kind of novel, highly detailed realism based on reporting, was to be any sort of new standard, their reputations were in serious trouble."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1478
Program Number S1195, 2828

"What the Market Does Not Accomplish"

Guests: Frank, Robert H.

19 January 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 6
Program details: There was much talk in this pre-election year about radical reform of the tax structure--from Dick Armey and Steve Forbes's flat tax (see Firing Line FLS125), to a value-added tax, to Mr. Frank's proposal: a consumption tax, which he defends engagingly here. It is not, please note, a luxury tax, despite the title of his book (Luxury Fever: Why Money Fails to Satisfy in an Era of Excess): "The government is just not well equipped to decide what's a luxury and what's not a luxury. Suppose I'm a schoolteacher and I love to sail, and I want to buy a $100,000 sailboat, and I have saved all my life to do it and I buy a good one. Who is some bureaucrat to tell me that that's a luxury I shouldn't buy? ... The tax I'm talking about makes no attempt to identify how you are spending your money. It just says the rate you pay on your consumption goes up the more you consume."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1479
Program Number S1196, 2829

"Legalize Pot?"

Guests: Zimmer, Lynn. : Safir, Howard.

12 January 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 11
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 6
Program details: Another go-around on the marijuana question, this time with the anti-legalization position represented by New York's very successful police commissioner. He is an adherent of the James Q. Wilson "broken window" theory, which holds that taking care of seemingly small things, like broken windows, has a disproportionate impact on major things. And sure enough, crime in New York City had dropped dramatically since the police started aggressively pursuing infractions such as "fare beating" on the subways, open drinking on the streets--and marijuana possession. A lively, sometimes heated, debate. HS: "If your premise is that there is something wrong with marijuana, then we should encourage not using it. We shouldn't encourage people to go out and continue to use marijuana, and legalization would do just that." LZ: "Look, I think there is something wrong with adultery, but I don't think the New York City Police Department should be out searching for adulterers."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1472
Program Number S1197, 2830

"Overturn Buckley v. Valeo?"

Guests: Glasser, Ira. : Rosenkranz, Joshua.

12 January 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 12
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 7
Program details: Campaign-finance reform had been hotly debated during the 1998 midterm elections. Comes now Mr. Rosenkranz, who in his book Buckley Stops Here: Loosening the Judicial Stranglehold on Campaign Finance Reform argued for overturning Buckley v. Valeo, which held that while the legislature could limit individual contributions it could not limit the amount a candidate (in this case, Senator James L. Buckley) could spend on his own behalf. Mr. Rosenkranz ably defends his position, but he has to contend not only with Senator Buckley's brother, but also with one of the nation's most formidable free-speech advocates. JR: "Corruption is not the only issue. It's also about equality, and what the Supreme Court took off the table is any argument that... voices should be about equal in the most important decisions that we make in our democracy, which is who should be elected to public office." IG: "You're right about that factually, but where we disagree is that, though I pine for more equality in speech as much as you do, what I am fearful of and what the Supreme Court was properly, I think, fearful of is allowing the government to decide that you have too much speech and I don't have enough."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1473
Program Number S1198, 2831

"Why Reject DNA Testing?"

Guests: Levy, Harlan.

31 March 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 13
Transcript: Box/Folder 109 : 7
Program details: Two recent cases--the O.J. Simpson murder trial and the investigation of President Clinton's relations with Monica Lewinsky--had brought DNA testing to the front pages, and various law-enforcement officials, including Attorney General Janet Reno, had proposed making DNA testing as widespread as the taking of fingerprints. This fascinating session focuses on the legal and logistical implications, but Mr. Levy also offers a breathtaking explanation of exactly what we're talking about: "Here we have this cell, which is really too small for us to imagine, and there's the 3-billion-rung structure within each cell in our body, that's identical in every cell in our body and yet unlike that of any other individual on the face of the earth.... It is ... individuation on a level that has almost theological implications to it."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1482
Program Number S1199, 2832

"Was There a Right-Wing Conspiracy?"

Guests: Adams, James Ring. : Conason, Joe.

31 March 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 14
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 8
Program details: "I think it's fair to say," Mr. Buckley begins, "that the most famous words ever uttered by Hillary Clinton are that the case against her husband was the working of a right-wing conspiracy." We might have thought nothing useful could still be said about this oversaturated story, but host and guests manage to put some of the details into perspective. JC: "There was a collusion going on between [Paula] Jones's attorneys, some of whom were a secret group of right-wingers,... and the prosecutor's office. And there's a real issue of whether that collusion was legitimate or not. I think it wasn't, and I think most people agree that it wasn't." ... WFB: "Who is responsible for the six-year campaign of vicious smears designed to destroy the Clintons?" JRA: "Actually, the Clintons.... The Clinton White House, which has continually delayed, obstructed the investigation,... denied documents, hidden documents ... I am committed to the Whitewater story itself. I think Lewinsky was a distraction and a symptom of the triviality of the press. But I think the story about the original attempt to squelch federal investigations of the savings-and-loan in which the Clintons were involved is the real story. And that has not been told yet."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1481
Program Number S1200, 2833

"Is Good Music Going Under?"

Guests: Chapin, Schuyler. : Tureck, Rosalyn.

31 March 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 15
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 8
Program details: These two favorite Firing Line guests continue, as in previous conversations, to refuse to share their host's pessimism about the future of good music. Before Miss Tureck sits down at the keyboard, she and Mr. Chapin talk buoyantly about the difference between listening to music live and on recording, the history of the widespread availability of professional-quality music, and--something new--the reintroduction of an arts curriculum in New York City's public schools. WFB: "You're optimistic, then, about the impact of the restoration of the arts in New York?" SC: "I am, absolutely.... New York, which was the pits in terms of arts education, in the last two and a half years has become the national urban leader.... Nobody said it better than Rudolph Giuliani when he made the announcement about this: that [the arts] are as important as the sciences and as important as the other humanities." WFB: "And you expect to be able to document that, say, ten years from now?" SC: "Absolutely. If we're wrong, than we really have a problem in education. But I do not think we are wrong." RT: "If you are wrong, we really have a problem with humanity."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1483
Program Number S1201, 2834

"Kosovo: What Do We Do Now?"

Guests: Neuhaus, Richard John.

15 April 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 16
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 9
Program details: The latest eruption in the former Yugoslavia was in Kosovo, a region which was ethnically 90 per cent Albanian, but which contained Kosovo Field, a national shrine for the Serbians. The Serbians, under their dictator Slobodan Milosevic, had attacked in force to prevent Kosovar secession. What should we--America, but also the West generally--be doing? Mr. Buckley and Father Neuhaus engage in a profound examination of the moral criteria--which include the practical criterion of, Will your policy achieve what it intends? RJN: "There are clear criteria as to what constitutes a just war and what constitutes justifiable actions within the context of a war.... I am afraid that if one looks very carefully at what we have done over the last seven or eight years in Serbia, Bosnia, Herzegovina, but particularly now with respect to this present intervention, this bombing, where we're dropping bombs into a thousand years of passionately entangled history in the Balkans, it doesn't meet any of the criteria of a justified war."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1484
Program Number S1202, 2835

"Kissinger's Years of Renewal"

Guests: Kissinger, Henry, 1923-

15 April 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 17
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 9
Program details: Mr. Kissinger's latest volume of memoirs covers the period from Richard Nixon's departure from the White House in August of 1974 to Gerald Ford's departure in January of 1977. Whatever conservatives may have thought about some of Mr. Kissinger's policies, his analysis is superb: "[Nixon] has some personality aspects--I don't know from what they derived, since I only met him after he had been elected-but he had a great fear of being rejected face to face. He had a need to affirm himself with dramatic statements.... And all of these tendencies come to appearance in the tapes.... He was perfectly capable of firing off a string of orders which those who knew never would have carried out.... You can read some bloodcurdling pronouncements [see Theodore H. White on the Enemies List, Firing Line s0192]. But what is never pointed out is, none of them was ever carried out. And none of the people who heard it said, 'Yes, Mr. President, we'll do it tomorrow morning.' Or reported back to him the next day even the slightest execution of them."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1485
Program Number S1203, 2836

"Do We Applaud the Conservative Movement?"

Guests: Edwards, Lee. : Lynn, Barry W.

15 April 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 18
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 10
Program details: A classic Firing Line face-off: to the title question, Mr. Edwards (and Mr. Buckley) reply with a resounding "Yes," Mr. Lynn with a resounding "No." There's a bit of So's-your-old-man, but also plenty of real substance. LE: "Clearly, if you go back fifty years and consider someone like Lionel Trilling-who referred to conservatism as a loose amalgam of irritable mental gestures-and then we see where we are today ... If we look at the increasing acceptance of conservatism, even in academe, with young people creating and editing and starting conservative publications... I think it's pretty clear that conservatism, as an idea has triumphed..." BL: "I don't applaud the conservative movement. I think you should be very careful about clapping over a house of cards, because when you clap and applaud, usually it knocks that house of cards right down, and that's what's going to happen to the conservative movement."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1486
Program Number S1204, 2837

"Professor Galbraith Names Names"

Guests: Galbraith, John Kenneth, 1908-2006.

18 May 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 19
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 10
Program details: Professor Galbraith had just written, WFB tells us, "a book of biographical sketches of mighty men and women he has known"-starting with Franklin Roosevelt, Eleanor Roosevelt, Albert Speer-"but was taunted by an associate who...said it sounded like a lot of name-dropping to him. Professor Galbraith thereupon changed his working title, and his book is now called Name-Dropping. A neat job of disarming his critics." While this show has some of the customary Buckley-Galbraith backchat, our host mostly encourages his guest to reminisce about his more than sixty years on the public scene. JKG: "Adlai was very much averse to anything that might be called rabble-rousing, anything which had a wider public appeal." WFB: "Was there a sharp distinction between his voice to the public and FDR's?" JKG: "Very much, yes. FDR would identify himself much better with the American public as a whole than could Adlai Stevenson. He was also much more susceptible to suggestion, recommendation. The great charm of FDR was that he had no fixed ideology, unlike you, Bill." WFB: "What causes my charm?" JKG: "And therefore he was open, or seemed to be open, to recommendations from a wide circle of people."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1487
Program Number S1205, 2838

"The Teachers Union vs. School Vouchers"

Guests: Feldman, Sandra. : Stern, Sol, 1935-

18 May 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 20
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 11
Program details: Another look at what is wrong with our schools and what might be done to fix them, this time focusing on whether the teachers unions, are putting self-interest ahead of the interests of the children. These two longtime adversaries tell us a lot in the course of a hard-hitting but mostly good-natured debate. SF: "Right now we are in a situation where we are seeing enormous improvement in our schools, and placing blame or pointing fingers isn't going to help us continue with that improvement..." SS: "There is a certain segment of our school population that is doing terribly. And we know who we're talking about: inner-city kids, kids in, for example...the South Bronx, in Bedford-Stuyvesant, in Harlem, vast wastelands...high schools where in many years more kids are killed outside the front of the school than wind up getting Regents' diplomas...And the reason we ought to both try to find blame and try to find alternatives is that we have a great stake in this as a society."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1488
Program Number S1206, 2839

"Is There an Inbuilt Bias in Police Inspection?"

Guests: Bratton, William J. : Glasser, Ira.

18 May 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 21
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 11
Program details: Mr. Bratton is, as Mr. Buckley puts it, "the godfather of police practices which... have caused a sharp reduction in crime wherever those practices are exercised." Mr. Glasser and the ACLU have called for federal intervention on the grounds that some of these practices are racist. Mr. Bratton defends himself ably in this lively and informative exchange. WB: "A lot of what I was about as police commissioner... was that over time we might be able to turn the attitude of police from seeing every black man they see in the street as a potential threat to them, to a situation where it requires much less police intervention in, particularly, minority communities, because there is a lot less crime and disorder happening. And then, over time, that might begin to have some impact on the issue of race in this country, because the most significant flashpoint between the races is police activity in minority communities...." IG: "It is fair to say that black people in this country, like white people, have a legitimate fear of crime and want there to be effective law enforcement." WFB: "They are the principal beneficiaries of it." IG: "But the fact is that many black people are as afraid of cops as they are of criminals. And that's a terrible thing."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1489
Program Number S1207, 2901

"On the Skills of Public Speaking"

Guests: Buckley, Fergus Reid, 1930- : Kiely, Laree.

29 June 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 22
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 12
Program details: A delicious look, with three masters of the craft, at why speaking skills matter and how to nurture them. RB (WFB's younger brother): "At one and the same time you have to be Hamlet, son of a foully murdered king, and also you must be Laurence Olivier playing Hamlet. You must be able to push yourself into the subject, into the topic, into that message that you have to get across, and at the same time abstract yourself from it. That is where your craft comes into play...." LSK: "Nervousness is good. Having an edge is a good thing. In fact, the people who give the worst presentations in my classes are the ones who think they give the best, because they think they can stand up and talk to anybody about anything, and in fact that's not good enough."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1490
Program Number S1208, 2902

"Looking Back on Senator Joe McCarthy [1999]"

Guests: Kramer, Hilton. : Navasky, Victor S.

29 June 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 23
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 12
Program details: Mr. Buckley had just published The Redhunter, a novel based on the life of Joe McCarthy (who had also been the subject of his second book back in 1954, McCarthy and His Enemies). This high-energy three-way conversation begins with the Senator but quickly moves to the subject of his investigations. WFB: "The Communist Control Act ... said: The Communist Party is not a party. Don't go around saying it's just like the Republican Party, it's just like the Democratic or the Socialist. It's not. It's the agency of a foreign power. Now if that is correct, oughtn't there to be some organized resistance to its imposture ... ?" VSN: "I think it's incorrect. The Communist Party was a party. It also was, at the leadership level, responsive to taking its line from Moscow. But at the membership level... they were people in Harlem who were fighting rent strikes and making common cause with the local merchants, regardless of what was said in Moscow...." HK: "I grew up in a milieu where there were many families that, children and parents, were members of the Communist Party. Everybody understood that their first loyalty was to the Soviet fatherland. It didn't even have to be spelled out. It was understood that what served Soviet interests came first."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1491
Program Number S1209

"Kosovo: A Pyrrhic Victory?"

Guests: Pipes, Richard.

29 June 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 24
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 13
Program details: The bombing of Serbia had resulted in: (a) zero NATO casualties, (b) President Milosevic's agreeing to a NATO role in Kosovo; (c) at least six thousand Serbian dead and $50 to $120 billion in physical damage. Where do we go from here? This conversation with a man who has spent his adult life studying the Soviet Union and related matters may not yield ultimate answers, but it gives us a way to think about human rights and the First World's responsibilities. RP: "I think that we should try to establish, if it's feasible, several security zones in the world where we'll say, 'Whatever happens in this zone is the responsibility of the neighboring countries.' Say there are violations of human rights in Africa. Those countries in Africa which are concerned with human rights should intervene, but it should not be up to the United States or to Europe. We should be responsible, I think, for Europe. And we in the United States should be responsible probably for the Americas." WFB: "But the Pipes Covenant would permit, would it not, help by Europe or America to Africans who were moving against Rwanda?" RP: "Absolutely. But it would not be our principal obligation, but theirs.
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1492
Program Number S1210, 2904

"What I Will Do as Mayor of New York City"

Guests: Green, Mark J.

15 July 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 25
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 13
Program details: Within the New York City political structure, Mr. Green, as Public Advocate, was the second-highest elected official, and thus the man who would have taken over as mayor had Rudolph Giuliani not been derailed from his plan of running for the U.S. Senate. A substantive and entertaining discussion with this longtime Firing Line panelist/examiner/guest. MG: "When you ran [for mayor] in 1965,... you had ideas to make welfare recipients work; eliminate diesel buses, which were polluting the air; provide substance-abuse counseling to addicts who wanted it ... I agree with all that. And so, you know, should I have to run for mayor, I may run on your platform. And ideally do better than 13 per cent."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1493
Program Number S1211, 2905

"Should Parents Be Notified?"

Guests: Feldt, Gloria, 1942-

15 July 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 26
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 14
Program details: A number of states had passed laws saying that an under-age girl seeking an abortion needed to get the permission of her parents. Some girls, inevitably, went to neighboring states instead, and Congress was considering a bill prohibiting this. Host and guest often talk past each other in this passionate discussion; we get both points of view clearly laid out, but not much interaction between them. WFB: "Don't you acknowledge the emotional trauma of people who go recklessly into the abortion mill without giving it the kind of consideration that might result from consulting their mothers?" GF: "Let me question a few of your assumptions. First, the biggest one is what the trauma is. The trauma is the unintended pregnancy."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1495
Program Number S1212, 2906

"One Mayor's Experience with Public Education"

Guests: Schundler, Bret.

15 July 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 27
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 14
Program details: Mr. Schundler, having done well on Wall Street, had been looking to enter political life, when the most unlikely opening presented itself: the then-mayor of the heavily minority, solidly Democratic Jersey City went to jail. Mr. Schundler ran for the office and won, becoming the first Republican mayor of Jersey City since World War I. Most viewers will be meeting him for the first time on this show, and the Republicans among them should be greatly interested in this engaging young star. Mr. Schundler: "The reason I changed from being a Democrat and became a Republican: I was a Democrat because as a Christian I feel that government, should be concerned, as the Scripture puts it, about the least of these. We should be out there trying to make sure that every American who is born has a decent chance to live on a safe street, has a chance to get a good education, has a chance to realize their dreams. And the Democrats' rhetoric is so wrapped up in that idea of being there for the underdog.... But then, working with the party, I became convinced over time that they didn't care about whether the programs were working or not. What they cared about were the interest groups who were invested in the programs.... I became a Republican because I saw people talking about changing the way programs operate to make them actually work."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1494
Program Number S1213, 2907

"What's Up in New Jersey on Abortion?"

Guests: George, Robert P.

17 August 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 146 : 28
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 15
Program details: A splendid session that begins with a particular bill being considered by the New Jersey state legislature-the New Jersey Post-Viability Abortion Act-but that goes on to examine with uncommon clarity a whole range of questions relating to fetal viability and maternal health. WFB: "Suppose I call in a psychiatrist and the psychiatrist says, 'I've known Mrs. Shaughnessy for years, and I detected two months ago a kind of frenzied fear that if she had another child it would simply ruin her life.... I therefore counseled removal of the child.' How do you handle that?" RPG: "Well, if the child is viable, the child can be removed without killing the child. That's the very definition of viability. The case should be treated no differently than you would treat a case of a woman who has a baby-let's say a month-old baby-who is experiencing severe postpartum trauma; the existence of the baby is bothering her and indeed causing psychological harm.... The answer is not to kill the baby. The answer is to attend to the needs of the woman."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1496
Program Number S1214, 2908

"What Do We Do Now about Taiwan?"

Guests: Lord, Winston.

17 August 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 147 : 1
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 16
Program details: President Lee of the Republic of China (Taiwan) had set off all the alarm bells, Mr. Buckley begins by telling us, "when he spoke of the looming need to deal with Taiwan as a separate diplomatic entity from China. This statement caused apoplectic denunciations in Peking, and apoplectic denunciations in Washington, the nostalgic fiction having endured for fifty years that Taiwan and China are a single country." This proves to be a low-key but highly informative discussion of the local history, parallels elsewhere (e.g., East and West Germany, North and South Korea), and future possibilities. WL: "The overwhelming majority of the Taiwan people--every poll shows 80 to 85 per cent prefer the status quo. Some of those say, 'Status quo indefinitely,' some of them say, 'Status quo and then some day maybe reunification,' some say, 'Status quo and some day independence,' But what they recognize is they have de facto independence.... Why try to make it de jure and be provocative?"
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1497
Program Number S1215, 2909

"Will Clinton Smother Tax Cuts?"

Guests: Kudlow, Lawrence.

17 August 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 147 : 2
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 17
Program details: The federal budget had gone from deficit to surplus, and Republicans--who still held a majority in both the Senate and the House, although they had lost seats in the latter in the 1998 elections--were pushing to return some of the money to the people in the form of tax cuts. President Clinton had vowed to veto any such bill. To help us sort out the economic and political considerations, we have a man who can certifiably crunch numbers, but who also can speak concretely of the people behind the numbers. LK: "Twenty years ago the U.S. was going down the road to becoming a welfare-dependent, government-dependent country. Today we have completely changed and transformed that culture, and we have become a nation of asset holders and investors and web-site owners and small-business people. Those folks want to be left alone. They're willing to exercise their own personal responsibility. They accept risk and they don't want government in the way."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1498
Program Number S1216

"An Ex-Mayor Examines His Successor"

Guests: Koch, Ed, 1924-

10 September 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 147 : 3
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 17
Program details: Mr. Buckley starts right in, in this return engagement of an always-popular Firing Line guest: "Why did you choose a title so nasty as the title you have given to this book?" Mr. Koch: "He is a mean-spirited person. And let me say this: I like him personally--I mean, in conversation, one to one, he is a charming person, and I don't regret the fact that I was one of four people who made it possible for him to win the first time." But, says the former mayor, Mr. Giuliani has a personality flaw that has undercut much of the good he has done (as when, for example, he fired Police Commissioner Bratton because he "was getting part of the credit" (cf. Firing Line #S1206) and that would unfit him for the Senate (this being before Mr. Giuliani's campaign to oppose Hillary Clinton for Daniel Patrick Moynihan's old seat disintegrated): "The fact is that Giuliani cannot work in the Senate because he can't work with anybody. He must have his way, and in the Senate you can't do that."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1501
Program Number S1217, 2911

"Gary Bauer for President"

Guests: Bauer, Gary Lee, 1946-

10 September 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 147 : 4
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 18
Program details: "We have," Mr. Buckley begins, "a presidential candidate here today to tell us why we should send him to the White House. His likelihood of getting there is somewhere between impossible and inconceivable. But then, by statistical arithmetic, that's true of most candidates for that office." And, Mr. Bauer replies, "Miracles do happen in politics." As we know, that particular miracle didn't pan out, but the discussion gives us a good perspective on the current scene. GB: "I don't think my candidacy should be thought of as Christian-oriented. My whole life has been devoted to public policy. There have been Christian candidates that define themselves that way, Pat Robertson being the most notable example. But all my life I've worked on public policy.... So I don't think voters should feel excluded at all. I think what they are looking at is a Reagan conservative who also feels strongly about his Christian faith."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1499
Program Number S1218, 2912

"Should Governor Bush Reform the Drug Laws?"

Guests: Glasser, Ira. : Morris, Dick.

10 September 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 147 : 5
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 18
Program details: It had been alleged that George W. Bush had once upon a time used cocaine; he had refused to confirm or deny. In any case, WFB is moved to ask:" Should he take advantage of the questions raised to look at the drug laws and to propose reform?" This fast-paced conversation alternates between (from Mr. Glasser) the rights and wrongs of the drug laws per se and (from Mr. Morris) the political implications. DM: "I think George Bush got--in a way that nobody else in the political world got and very few journalists understood--that it wasn't a question of, The public didn't want to know. It was a question of, The public wanted not to know. Because the average voter, particularly young parents trying to raise children, were a lot less interested in whether the next President ... had ever used cocaine than in making sure their own children didn't come to them and say, 'Hey, I'm going to use some cocaine; Bush did.'"... IG:"He seems to say, 'I believe in redemption; I believe in overcoming youthful errors. But meanwhile he has been supporting legislation that would take people who make the same mistake ... when they are young and irresponsible--18, 19, 20--and subject them to 15-year jail sentences."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1500
Program Number S1219, 2913

"Philanthropy and the Conservative Movement"

Guests: Simon, William E., 1927-

4 October 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 147 : 6
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 19
Program details: Both in his own person and as head of the Olin Foundation, Mr. Simon was one of the country's leading philanthropists, and superbly qualified to discuss proposals, such as one recently made by Governor George W. Bush, to pump-prime private philanthropy through government action. WFB: "When Reagan left office, 19.8 per cent of GDP was going into the Federal Government. It's now 21.8. That's a very substantial rise. So that notwithstanding what Mr. Clinton said, that the age of big government is over, in fact, government continues to swell, right?" WES: "The fact of the matter is,... you have to work until May now before you keep your own money. May 11, I think it was last year. Now think of that! You are working five months for government before you can work for yourselves. That's too much right there, so let's not talk about more of a government bite, more of a government take on anything."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1502
Program Number S1220, 2914

"Saving the Environment from the Environmentalists"

Guests: Huber, Peter W. (Peter William), 1952-

4 October 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 147 : 8
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 19
Program details: The title of this show was the subtitle of Mr. Huber's latest book, titled Hard Green. An exhilarating tour of planet Earth, from fanning technology to trace toxins, from global warming to the correlation between wealth and conservation. One sample: WFB: "People who have read your book ... are now referring to it as the great answer to Al Gore's book. I mean, it's a lot of other things too, but is it correct that you sort of take him on pretty directly? ..." PH: "The book wasn't written with the express purpose of debating our Vice President, but I do think his book bears re-reading by people who want to see just how silly--forgive me, but just how silly modern environmentalism can get. Where it is coherent, and it often isn't, it really puts forward a conception of things and where our society is going that is tremendously gloomy and pessimistic, and it seems to me refuted, where it's concrete enough to be refuted at all, by all the available evidence and empirical trends in recent history."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1503
Program Number S1221, 2915

"The Legislative Struggle, Long Term"

Guests: Cox, Christopher, 1952- : Hyde, Henry J.

2 November 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 147 : 9
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 20
Program details: This show (taped after s1222 but broadcast before it) begins the countdown for Firing Line. These two shows--this one focusing on domestic policy, the following one on foreign policy--each feature a major figure from the 20th century and an up-and-comer for the 21st. This one suffers slightly from the fact that, because it was election day, our guests are beamed in via satellite. But what the conservation lacks in give-and-take, it makes up for in substance. CC: "Politics is the business of talking to people--if you can, one at a time, or alternatively in reasonably small groups so that there is still a personal message. And that's why affiliation politics will always remain important, even in a country such as ours, where we stress the importance of looking at every person as an individual and not as a member of some group or class. We want people to be completely mobile, as a matter of policy, between what other cultures might define as classes--we don't--and among groups." ... HJH: "We're in a political situation where the Democrats have expressed themselves as not wanting to legislate. They really have a vested interest in not passing legislation, blaming us as a do-nothing Congress, and using that canard to vault themselves back into power.... So we have to not only get ourselves excited about legislation, but we have to persuade a few Democrats to join us so we can pass something.""
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1504
Program Number S1222, 2916

"The Conservative Search for a Foreign Policy"

Guests: Zakaria, Fareed. : Kissinger, Henry, 1923-

2 November 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 147 : 10
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 20
Program details: Slower-moving than some, this show has a certain grandeur. Big themes are dealt with in a serious way that it is hard to imagine any other television show replicating in the near future. FZ: "I think the broader shift is probably not ethnic but generational....I think Americans now in their fifties, sixties, and seventies grew up in a world in which their personal lives became interconnected with the great events of history--through World War II, through the Marshall Plan, through NATO, through the Korean War. They felt a connection between what they were doing personally and these events. Americans of subsequent generations, particularly Americans of my generation [Mr. Zakaria was born in 1965],...having grown up in times of peace and prosperity, feel themselves utterly unconnected with these broader events..." HK: "Your point is: Can foreign policy be internationalized to a point where sovereignty becomes less important, in a sense, than some international standard by which you can intervene in cases that occur within the territory of another state? I think it's important to remember that the doctrine of sovereignty arose at the end of the religious wars of the 17th century, in which borders had become very permeable and millions were killed in pursuit of abstract justice by one side or the other....Of course there are outrages of a kind that probably demand international intervention. But as a general proposition, I believe that the present definition of so-called humanitarian intervention is arbitrary."
Availability: On amazon.com. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1505
Program Number S1223, 2917

"William F. Buckley Jr. and Students of Ole Miss"

Guests: Allen, Jonathan. : Blakey, Elizabeth. : Bowers, Barrett. : Crockett, Justin. : Downs, Jimmy Joe. : Hitchcock, Shay. : Landreth, Rex. : Powers, Anna. : Stockstill, James. : Thomas, Karla. : Webster, Clarence.

3 December 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 147 : 11
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 21
Program details: Ole Miss had been the setting for many Firing Line debates, and so it seemed a fitting venue for this final chance for student panelists to question WFB. The discussion mostly revolves around the funding of student groups through compulsory student-activity fees, but along the way it turns to the use of tax money in general, public goods versus private goods, and the idea of community. Mr. Downs: "And I think it is unconstitutional that ... students like us be forced to pay student-activity fees." WFB: "I pay fees every day to that terrible man in the White House, who, you know, sort of spills my little pennies around and other people's. Why should that be a collective enterprise in a sense that this ought not to be?" Ms. Powers: "Indirectly you had a say in electing Bill Clinton, and--" WFB: "Well, but you have a vote in whether to come to Ole Miss or not, right?" AP: "Right, and I am agreeing with you in that respect because... especially at Ole Miss our student-activity fees are funneled through the associated student body ... So long as you have that representative democracy, I don't think that you can argue against the activity fees."
Availability: Not available. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1506
Program Number S1224, 2918

"The End of Firing Line: Part I"

Guests: Kinsley, Michael E. : Green, Mark J. : Lowry, Richard. : Brookhiser, Richard. : Kristol, William. : Robinson, Peter, 1957- : Nixon, Richard M. (Richard Milhous), 1913-1994. : Ford, Gerald R., 1913- : Reagan, Ronald. : Teresa, Mother, 1910- : Jackson, Jesse, 1941- : Ginsberg, Allen, 1926-

14 December 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 147 : 12
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 21
Program details: This pair of farewell shows begins with a pastiche of excerpts from Firing Line (featuring Richard Nixon, Gerald Ford, Ronald Reagan, Mother Teresa, Jesse Jackson, and many more) and closes with excerpts from Mr. Buckley's appearances on other shows (including Laugh-In) and imitations of him by, e.g., David Frye. In between, WFB and his guests talk about New York versus Washington, the state of the tax-code debate-and the effect of Firing Line. RB: "When we were looking at some of those clippings, you weren't just debating liberals, you were debating actual radicals. You were debating people all across the spectrum, Jesse Jackson when he was far more leftwing than he is today,... Allen Ginsberg, a homosexual Jewish Hindu. You know, people from all across-" WFB: "There are still a lot of them today." RB: "But how often do they get an hour of television? How often does anyone with an intelligent opinion get an hour of television? We've just finished three series of presidential debates. We have men who want to be the most powerful man in the world having to utter haiku and slip them into 45-second slots, and that's the level of discourse." ... WFB: "So there it is, ladies and gentlemen. I wish you Godspeed."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1508
Program Number S1225, 2919

"The End of Firing Line: Part II"

Guests: Kinsley, Michael E. : Green, Mark J. : Lowry, Richard. : Brookhiser, Richard. : Kristol, William. : Robinson, Peter, 1957- : Teresa, Mother, 1910- : Nixon, Richard M. (Richard Milhous), 1913-1994. : Ford, Gerald R., 1913- : Reagan, Ronald. : Jackson, Jesse, 1941- : Ginsberg, Allen, 1926-

14 December 1999

Scope and Contents note

Publicity File: Box/Folder 147 : 13
Transcript: Box/Folder 190 : 21
Program details: This pair of farewell shows begins with a pastiche of excerpts from Firing Line (featuring Richard Nixon, Gerald Ford, Ronald Reagan, Mother Teresa, Jesse Jackson, and many more) and closes with excerpts from Mr. Buckley's appearances on other shows (including Laugh-In) and imitations of him by, e.g., David Frye. In between, WFB and his guests talk about New York versus Washington, the state of the tax-code debate-and the effect of Firing Line. RB: "When we were looking at some of those clippings, you weren't just debating liberals, you were debating actual radicals. You were debating people all across the spectrum, Jesse Jackson when he was far more leftwing than he is today,... Allen Ginsberg, a homosexual Jewish Hindu. You know, people from all across-" WFB: "There are still a lot of them today." RB: "But how often do they get an hour of television? How often does anyone with an intelligent opinion get an hour of television? We've just finished three series of presidential debates. We have men who want to be the most powerful man in the world having to utter haiku and slip them into 45-second slots, and that's the level of discourse." ... WFB: "So there it is, ladies and gentlemen. I wish you Godspeed."
Availability: Special order, please contact the Archives. Hoover Identifier number: 80040.1509
Boxes 1-69, 193

Production Materials File, 1966-1994

Boxes 1-15, 193

Administrative files, 1966-1994

Scope and Contents note

The files include a catalogue of transcripts, guest and topic lists, a card catalogue of Firing Line guests, memoranda, pamphlets, press releases, press reviews, newsletters, clippings, correspondence, photographs, negatives, microfiche, and slides. This section contains correspondence with prominent politicians, economists, and scientists, as well as viewer comments and suggestions, arranged chronologically. Also includes personal information of William F. Buckley Jr. and Warren Steibel, the Firing Line producer-director. Additionally, photographs, negatives, and slides depict William F. Buckley Jr. individually and with the guests of his shows. Also includes an oversize photo of William F. Buckley Jr.

Arrangement note

Arranged chronologically.
 

General, 1966-1999

Box 1

Catalogue of transcripts/audio cassettes, 1971-1999

Box 1

Guest and topic lists, 1966-1999

Box 1

Program lists, 1977-1999

Box 1

Special Debates lists, 1986-1999

Box 1

Fonts and messages, 1995-1999

Physical Description: 90 MB Bernoulli disc
Box 1

Theme music (compact disc), 1998

Box 1

Fifth anniversary, 1971

Box 1

Twenty-fifth anniversary, 1991

Boxes 2-3

Card catalogue, Firing Line guests (A-Z) circa 1966-1999

Box 4

Microfiche of early program transcripts, numbers 1-113, 1966-1968

Box 5

Press releases, press reviews, and newspaper clippings, 1970-1994

Box 5

Newsletters, 1968-1984

Box 6

Newsletters, 1985-1994

Box 6

Introductions and notes, circa 1970-1990

Box 6

Memoranda, pamphlets, and other materials, 1970-1978

Box 6

Warren Steibel, Firing Line producer-director files, 1994-1997

Scope and Contents note

Includes his extensive memoranda to program managers.
Box 193

Two flyers depicting African American young man called "Would You Be More Careful if It Was You That Got Pregnant?" (oversize), undated

 

William F. Buckley Jr. files, 1985-1992

Box 7

Personal information, circa 1970-1980

Box 7

Commencement, University of South Carolina, 1985 December 15

Box 7

On the Firing Line: The Public Life of Our Public Figures , Random House, New York (printed copy), 1989

Box 7

Asian trip, 1992

Box 8

Photographs, circa 1966-1999

Scope and Contents note

Photographic prints and contact sheets depicting William F. Buckley Jr. individually and with the guests of his show, including some on the set and/or behind the scenes of Firing Line. The last folder is mainly promotional materials, including some photos.
Box 193

William F. Buckley Jr. photo (oversize), undated

Box 9

Negatives, circa 1966-1999

Scope and Contents note

Contains negatives and contacts from various moments during Firing Line shows and their participants. Includes negatives and contact sheets in envelopes and select negatives and contacts for newsletter, most labeled with episode # and/or guest(s).
Boxes 9-10

Slides, circa 1966-1990

Scope and Contents note

Consists of 35mm color slides, depicting moments on Firing Line shows and their participants, though mainly of William F. Buckley Jr. Also includes slides of the Firing Line set, various Firing Line logos and credits, and slides of 1980s SCETV show Six Gun Heroes.
Boxes 11-15

Correspondence, 1966-1994

Arrangement note

Arranged chronologically.
Box 11

General correspondence, 1966

Box 11

Viewer comments, 1966

Box 11

General correspondence, 1967

Box 11

Viewer comments, 1967

Box 11

General correspondence, 1968

Box 11

Firing Line guests suggestions and comments, 1968

Box 12

Business, 1968

Box 12

General correspondence, 1969

Box 12

Firing Line guests suggestions and comments, 1969

Box 12

Alphabetical (A-R) 1970-1978

Box 13

Alphabetical (P-Z) 1970-1978

Box 13

Omega Communications, 1980-1982

Box 13

General correspondence, 1981

Box 13

Friends of Firing Line, 1981-1983

Box 14

Firing Line guests, 1982

Box 14

General correspondence, 1983

Box 14

Unemployment letters, 1983

Box 14

General correspondence, 1984

Box 14

Firing Line guests, 1984

Box 14

Friends of Firing Line, 1984

Box 14

General correspondence, 1985

Box 14

Firing Line guests, 1985

Box 14

General correspondence, 1986

Box 14

Firing Line guests, 1986

Box 14

Viewer correspondence on the program "Harvest of Despair," 1986

Box 15

General correspondence, 1987

Box 15

Firing Line guests, 1987

Box 15

General correspondence, 1988

Box 15

Firing Line guests, 1988

Box 15

General correspondence, 1989

Box 15

Firing Line guests, 1989

Box 15

General correspondence, 1990

Box 15

General correspondence, 1991

Box 15

General correspondence, 1993-1994

Boxes 16-69

Speaker and research files, 1966-1999

Scope and Contents note

Arranged alphabetically by the topic or last name of the speaker, though not all speakers have a file. Original file labeling retained, with all personal names listed last name, first name.
Box/Folder 16 : 1

"Abortion" St. John-Stevas, Norman; O'Rourke, Rev. Joseph; Hentoff, Margot, March 31, 1975

Box/Folder 16 : 2

"Abortion and the Law" Pilpel, Harriet; Hyde, Rev. Henry J., October 5, 1977

Box/Folder 16 : 3

"Abortion Legal Aspects" Noonan, John, circa 1970

Box/Folder 16 : 4

"Abortion: Yes or No" Noonan, John T., Jr.; Lucas, Roy, July 25, 1972

Box/Folder 16 : 5

Abel, Richard, June 23, 1979

Box/Folder 16 : 6

Abram, Morris, July 20, 1983

Box/Folder 16 : 7

Abram, Morris, June 23, 1982

Box/Folder 16 : 8

Abrams, Elliot, 1984

Box/Folder 16 : 9

Abrams, Elliot, August 19, 1987

Box/Folder 16: 10

Abrams, Elliot, February 23, 1987

Box/Folder 16 : 11

Abrams, Floyd, January 15, 1979

Box/Folder 16 : 12

Abrams, Floyd, July 10, 1990

Box/Folder 17 : 1

Ackerman, Mike; Jenkins, Brian; Merari, Ariel, Dr., September 26, 1985

Box/Folder 17 : 2

Adelman, Morris; Ritchie, Jack, September 13, 1973

Box/Folder 17 : 3

Adler, Mortimer, February 15, 1980

Box/Folder 17 : 4

Adler, Mortimer, February 25, 1981

Box/Folder 17 : 5

Adler, Mortimer, May 8, 1985

Box/Folder 17 : 6

Adler, Mortimer, January 23, 1986

Box/Folder 17 : 7

Adler, Mortimer, March 1, 1982

Box/Folder 17 : 8

Adler, Mortimer, October 27, 1982

Box/Folder 17 : 9

Adler, Mortimer, April 14, 1983

Box/Folder 17 : 10

Adler, Mortimer, October 11, 1984

Box/Folder 17 : 11

Adler, Mortimer, April 6m 1987

Box/Folder 17 : 12

Adler, Mortimer, May 6, 1988

Box/Folder 17 : 13

Adler, Mortimer, June 7, 1989

Box/Folder 17 : 14

Adler, Mortimer, June 6, 1990

Box/Folder 17 : 15